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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Since the last posts were deleted. I try again. I am interested in trying an XR for rally. I am concerned about availability of parts and the cost of parts. My original intentions were to run a G2 VW Golf and use lots of scrap yard parts to fill it out. My understanding is that the XR is very competitive and can be oufitted for every class.

The XR shares at least some parts with the SVO mustang and the turbo Tbird. How many parts? Brakes? Suspension? Control arms? etc.?

The XR is very popular in the UK as a racer. How difficult/expensive to get the performance parts to the US? Available in the US? Particularly the 4wd conversion I keep hearing about. Is this a simple bolt on ceonversion or does it require a merchanical engineer?

If their is a better route for a first rally car please let me know. But I like rear wheel drive alot.

Matt Smith
[email protected]
 

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>Since the last posts were deleted. I try again. I am
>interested in trying an XR for rally. I am concerned about
>availability of parts and the cost of parts. My original
>intentions were to run a G2 VW Golf and use lots of scrap
>yard parts to fill it out. My understanding is that the XR
>is very competitive and can be oufitted for every class.
>
>The XR shares at least some parts with the SVO mustang and
>the turbo Tbird. How many parts? Brakes? Suspension?
>Control arms? etc.?
¤¤¤They share motor, management system EEEK!4, although some ECUs are waaaay beachinger giving 205 HP stock vs the XRatty 175 hp, and thats it.
>
>The XR is very popular in the UK as a racer.
¤¤¤¤ Not really as a racer, in the rest of the world a 'race' car is strictly a 'road race car' you know something for guys with limited attention span, can only handle 8-9 turns a day maybe, never go sideways with spinning out completely, or talk endlessly about 'brilliant save' if they squirm a bit teee heee,.
The various versions Have been popular as Rally cars, but popular enough that the things you need don't show up so often or are a pain to ship.
To that end JVAB in Seattle is in the midst of remanufacturing a number of the parts needed to make the car into a gravel car.
Ford motorsport Sierra/Saphire/Escort Cosworth parts are numbered 909¤¤¤, so JVAB is calling things 606 for easy reference. Some of the junk inprogress right now are: Sump gaurd mount front, sump gaurd, sumpgaurd center support in 'Safari' spec, diff gaurd is next, front Chrome moly strut tubes are in process, although they may be upgraded to 50mm before we are out of prototype stage.
These thing are worth doing new as there are enough guys starting out with the car right now to justify short runs of each thing.

How
>difficult/expensive to get the performance parts to the US?
>Available in the US? Particularly the 4wd conversion I keep
>hearing about. Is this a simple bolt on ceonversion or does
Far easier if you AREN'T a mechanical engineer! everything in te world is easier! All the parts for 4wd bolt straight in allthough to mate the box to the 2.3 takes a bit of fiddling with sumps, and a bit of welding on the sumps, it can be done. RWD is easier and the class is cool, Gp5.
>it require a merchanical engineer?
>
>If their is a better route for a first rally car please let
>me know. But I like rear wheel drive alot.
Well between Brian 'Kartwheel' in Pepsicola, Andrew 'Lefty' Steere in Nude Hampster, 'Haulin Colin' Mccleery in Michojaucan, and here in Washington Miller in Everett, Billie Milligan in West Sleezattle, Scott and Jason the 'Merkurboys' in Spokane and very probably Vance Walker in Portland there is sufficient numbers to generate some interest and specific parts.
Maybe you and Kartwheel can share shipping on a couple of JVAB Fia spec cage kits.
Better call JVAB in Seattle.
>
>Matt Smith
>[email protected]
PS you will want bigger brakes, bigger wheel studs 14mm, strengthened rear trailing arms, rear discs, real motor, trans and diff mounts, and all these things are also in early stage of reproduction. Pictures to follow.

John Vanlandingham
 

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Yeah, I have pretty much resolved myself that the Exsquirt is a waste of time so I am going to go straight to the XRatty. I looked at Colin's at 100AW, and those Grp N Bilsteins he had on the front looked sweet!


Brian
 

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>¤¤¤They share motor, management system EEEK!4, although some
>ECUs are waaaay beachinger giving 205 HP stock vs the XRatty
>175 hp, and thats it.

John, you naughty NAUGHTY boy, how dare you use the word "beach" in such a profane fashion! Don't you ever consider the tender ears of the pro-le-ralliat before you speak? And think of what the environmental extremists will think when you mention beaches and motorsport in the same sentence? Think of the implications of your posts, man!

}>

As for the XR's suitability for rally, just ask current US rally star Mark Lovell, he did a LOT of the test driving on the Sierra and Escort Cosworth. If the car was waaaaaaaay beaching for that dude (uh, oh) at high levels of competition when it was new, it should be more than OK for a newbie in North America today.

Now to find the money to put my car together.

--Andrew Steere
Dover, NH
[email protected]
...XR4Ti rally car, some (complete):'( assembly required...
 

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John,

Things are going to move along quicker now that I have stopped fretting over if I was going to build the Exsquirt or not. I was in quite a dilema. I didnt want to build the XRatty as my first car and risk destroying it, but then again I didnt want to put all the time and money into the Exsuirt and have nothing to show for it but a car worth crashing and not one worth keeping.

I finally decided that I can find XRatty's easy enough that I can build it right from the start and re-shell if/when I crunch it, which is what you have told me all along. I'll call you this weekend. I'm off on sunday's and monday's, so I'll probably call you monday if thats good for you.


Brian-(not sitting on the fence anymore)
 

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John Vanlandingham
Good for you then, and why don't you find one for Mothra too.
and maybe one for Rodan at the same time.

I finally have things moving with the boys out here, sorta barn raising efforts to get several of the shells cleaned out and getting the stands so we can put the cars up and twirl them around.

Parts are being sheared and water-jet cut as we speak, get ready.
 

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>Can the escort even run in rally without breaking. So now
>the hard part trying to find a xr for sale on the east
>coast. And to think I had decided to buy a prepared car and
>now I am back to building again.
>
>Matt
>[email protected]

John Vanlandingham

Hey Matt, you been in touch with Brian 'Kartwheel' yet? He's in Pensacola, FL and can probably help you find a starter shell, and there are a bunch of XR nuts in the Washington DC area know as NOVMOG or some such name and I can put you in touch with them if you want.

An alternate idea occured to me since we are about to start up small scale production of XRs with cages welded in (at least it seems like it). Have us make you a prepped roller shell, you concentrate on the rest. Then fly or drive out and drag it home, and assemble your powerplant into it and go.

whaddya sink?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
First a classic newbie question What exactly defines a shell? rolling shell? I see these terms used often but I am not sure if my perceptions are accurate. Anyone want to enlighten me.

A rolling shell sounds interesting. I have spent the last week scouring North Carolina in search of a donor car to go with a shell if I could find one. Found an 1987 donor but doesn't run. Are all model years compatible?

I have been talking to Chris sanborn in New Hampshire about his Sierra project shell. Does anyone know anything about this particular shell?

and John where would I have to come to pick up a shell from you?

Matt
 

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Hi Matt,
OK shell is just that, the BODYSHELL,
The English will put shell w BBD (Boot, bonnet and doors),
but what I am suggesting when I say roller, or rolling shell is a car with bodyshell, glass, doors, wiring loom, steering, some sort of suspension to roll it around with.

I know Chris' shell because I found it for him, it belonged to a high school kid that lived across the street from my shop in Woburn, MA.

Joe bought it for like $350, drove it around for the summer blew the trans to hell and parked it. In a classic 3 way deal, I called Andrew 'Lefty' Steere in Dover NH, suggested he buy it for the 64k mile motor in it and then give the shell to Sanborn, but he hesitated and Chris snagged it.

The cage is one of my FIA spec imported kits with the 50mm mainhoop although the main hoops rear supports would really need to be moved to the top of the shock mounts, you could negotiate that with Chris.

As from from me, I am in Sleezattle Washlincoln.
Whole cars can also be arranged, all it takes is money. I have 4 donor cars in the parking lot. Delivery can also be arranged.















John Vanladingham
 

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If you are looking for XRatty's, go to www.merkurdesktop.com. At the top of the main page is a link to their for sale/wanted page called "e-market". There you will find lots of XR4Ti's listed all over the country, many of them have "Make offer" as the price, those are the ones you want. ;) This is where I found Sanborn's car advertized.

You really dont care what year it is, but 87-89 is preferable because it has the wider trans tunnel to make the 4X4 swap easier, or if its 5 speed or auto since the T-9 5 speed that came stock is junk and you will have to replace it with a T-5 anyway. T-5's are the 5 speed that is in most Moostang 5.0's. They are not supercheap, but they will be indestructable behind a turbo 2.3, which can not be said of the T-9. I just found a great running '87 that is in near perfect condition save for a broken transmission for $200, you just cant beat that. You can find deals like that if you have time to wait.


Brian
 

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>If you are looking for XRatty's, go to

>You really dont care what year it is, but 87-89 is
>preferable because it has the wider trans tunnel to make the
>4X4 swap easier, or if its 5 speed or auto since the T-9 5
>speed that came stock is junk and

Oi, Oi, Oi! XRatty dogma leaps forth!
Tran-X and Quaiffe say the Typ9 is good for 275 ft/lbs. It is used by many many Opel and Volvo guys in Sweden cause its good enough for their 190-230 bhp cars and the close ratio gearsets are only 1/3 the price of their gearsets.

The myth comes no doubt from those onanistic drag racing boys who feel compelled to rev it up to 4500rpm abd side step the clutch. Again and again. Problem with the box or with the obsessive neurotic compulsion of the owners?




you will have to replace
>it with a T-5 anyway. T-5's are the 5 speed that is in most
>Moostang 5.0's. They are not supercheap, but they will be
>indestructable behind a turbo 2.3, which can not be said of
>the T-9. I just found a great running '87 that is in near
>perfect condition save for a broken transmission for $200,
>you just cant beat that. You can find deals like that if you

Be careful of some of the Thunder-chicken and some 2.3 powered Moosetang boxes, they have atrocious ratios ,horrible really. Best are up to 85 Mooostang V8 box with the 2.95 first



>have time to wait.
>
>
>Brian

















John Vanladingham
 

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RE: Whos Dogma is that running loose??

For my car I had to buy a T-5 because the original T-9 had been swapped for an Otto-Majik, so it was an easy choise for me.

Initially I thought the same thing as you John. I chalked up the reports of the T-9 being weak to drag racers blowing them up on the start line. What really got my attention, and made me think there might be something to it, was during my nice chat with Colin McCleery at 100AW he said "If you havent dont it yet, do yourself a favor and get a T-5." He had at least one DNF from transmission failure with the T-9, and I dont think that would be a problem with a T-5.
 

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RE: Whos Dogma is that running loose??

Well my first post was chewed up and spat up into the nether word of lost messages and I was waaaaaay pisssed off so the part where I had originally said something to the effect of:

'Haulin' Colin had good service from his Typ 9 for quite q long time and without a doubt it went straight into rally service from a long life as a street box, with a rebuild, the same way as everybody does.
(Hey Colin, are you gonna drag the XR out this spring? Find what was dead in the motor?)


Got deleted.Or lost and I was too peaced to write the whole thing again

The gist Brian is that yes if Mothra finds a slush-o-matic, fine buy it and buy a T5, if he finds a manual box be it typ9 or T5 good, the box however is lower down the priority list than say HMMMmmmmmm
FINDING and Buying a car! Ordering cage and suspenders! etc

Hey Mothra, if you eventually go the T5 route, call JVAB for trans mounts and cross member, copy of GpA part weighs about 2½ lbs vs 25+ for the railroad scrap sold elsewhere.


Watch out for that karma! (beep beep!)













John Vanladingham
 

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RE: Whos Dogma is that running loose??

>The gist Brian is that yes if Mothra finds a slush-o-matic,
>fine buy it and buy a T5, if he finds a manual box be it
>typ9 or T5 good, the box however is lower down the priority
>list than say HMMMmmmmmm
>FINDING and Buying a car! Ordering cage and suspenders! etc

Thats what I was trying, not so sucessfully, to say. The trans in the car is not as important as actually finding the car, and getting the imortant bits going.
 

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RE: Whos Dogma is that running loose??

OK, I just found an '86 XRatty in Raleigh for Mothra and I sent him the sellers email. The price was "$0 best offer", just right. :)

First hurdle is on the way to being crossed.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
RE: Hey mothra, gonna snag this one, price is right!

Thought I would thank everyone who has provided me with help upto this point. Especially John and Brian. I am currently chasing 2 separate xr's here in NC. An '87 and an '86 (thanks Brian). Probably should try and pick up both. Now what to do about a cage?
 

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RE: Hey mothra, gonna snag this one, price is right!

>Thought I would thank everyone who has provided me with help
>upto this point. Especially John and Brian. I am currently
>chasing 2 separate xr's here in NC. An '87 and an '86
>(thanks Brian). Probably should try and pick up both. Now
>what to do about a cage?

You're welcome to the asylum.
Yeah, get both if you can for cheap, having a spare to either canabalize or reshell into should you really wad it up is a good thing. A really good thing.
For cage, do like what 'Wild' Billy from Waste Sleezeattle, Miller 'Genuine' from Ever-rot, John Street from Blah-void, and Brian from Pepsicola are going to do: call me.Call me now.

You need to start searching for someplace that will be willing to do the installation unless you are going to try it yourself, not the done thing for most people, especially if you're not a welder fitter by trade.

You should start looking for cheap 15" wheels, I reccomend 85 and later SAAB 9000, 6x15, not so strong but they don't break, right offset, good caliper clearance. And you ought to be able to find them cause the cars are hitting the wreckers. Exsquirt GT have OK wheels also, and they're 6x15, too.
All the brake kits I will invent will be for 15s.

Ask who you talk to if the can do the 'notches' and welding if you get a more or less complete cage kit.


Hey Jim Konkler!! Any of those leads pan out for you? Time for a cage kit yet?
















John Vanlandingham
 
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