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just another old phart
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Does anybody know how this rule is written? Will it theoretically be possible for the rally leader, assuming a big enough lead, to crash out of the last stage, take his five minute penalty and still be declared the winner of the event? Wouldn't that be fun for the legitimacy (or lack thereof) of the new version of the sport? }(

Kent Gardam
 
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FIA World Rally Championship Rules (http://www.fia.com/resources/documents/568522310__WRC_reg_a.pdf)

3.5.3 Legs 2 and 3 (always based on the classification determined at the finish of the final special stage of the previous leg excluding any Super Special Stage).

a) Any crew which has retired from Leg 1 and/or Leg 2 may re-start the Rally from the start of the next leg. However, the crew will be penalised with a 5-minute penalty added to the fastest time of the drivers’ priority group (P1, P2, P3) for each missed stage which shall include the special stage or Super Special Stage on which the crew has retired. Should retirement occur after the last special stage or Super Special Stage, the crew will nonetheless be deemed to have missed that last special stage or Super Special Stage. For non-priority drivers, this 5-minute time penalty will be added to the fastest time achieved in its class.

3.5.4 Leg 3
Any crew which has retired from Leg 3 will be classified after the application of a 5-minute time penalty added to the fastest time of the drivers’ priority group (P1, P2, P3) for each missed stage which shall include the special stage or Super Special Stage on which the crew has retired.
Should retirement occur after the last special stage or Super Special Stage, the crew will nonetheless be deemed to have missed that last special stage or Super Special Stage.
For non-priority drivers, this 5-minute time penalty will be added to the fastest time achieved in its class.
However, in order to be classified, their car must be present in the finish Parc Fermé before the publication of the provisional final results.
 

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just another old phart
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
>3.5.4 Leg 3
>Any crew which has retired from Leg 3 will be classified after
>the application of a 5-minute time penalty added to the
>fastest time of the drivers’ priority group (P1, P2, P3) for
>each missed stage which shall include the special stage or
>Super Special Stage on which the crew has retired.
>Should retirement occur after the last special stage or Super
>Special Stage, the crew will nonetheless be deemed to have
>missed that last special stage or Super Special Stage.
>For non-priority drivers, this 5-minute time penalty will be
>added to the fastest time achieved in its class.
>However, in order to be classified, their car must be present
>in the finish Parc Fermé before the publication of the
>provisional final results.


So there you go folks. Sooner or later somebody is gonna win a WRC rally standing on their balled up car that has been towed to Parc Ferme!
 

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1973 WRC POR
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>So there you go folks. Sooner or later somebody is gonna win
>a WRC rally standing on their balled up car that has been
>towed to Parc Ferme!

It's the modern era of rallying Kent. Not like our day when Fiat had to have a barn full of spare rally cars to accomplish the same thing. :)

Anyway, it's just another reason why I no longer have any interest in the WRC.

Late last year, my cable provider dropped Speed. At first, I was upset as I would be missing the last three WRC events of the year (well, only one really, as there were two tarmac events). I found that I did not miss them at all.

In fact, I cannot understand the number of threads on many forums about getting the WRC back on TV. I figure that it is a bonus that it is no longer there.

Doug Woods
 

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And "real" rally or not, having WRC on Speed brought the sport to a much broader audience. Most of the people I know who are interested or involved in rally discovered it by doing more research after seeing it on TV. The loss of any rally-related television coverage is bad for the sport. I'm amazing that ISC/WRC isn't doing all in it's power to get a network over here.
 

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I have a cat.
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Cool. Its like the farmers who get paid to not grow crops. You could feasibly DNF all 3 days for a penalty of 15 minutes.

I think I will enter a WRC round next year. The car I would most like to not drive is the Peugot 206WRC. I will enter with that car on my entry form and finish exactly 15 minutes behind the leader...I just have to rent a Pug 206 and drive it from the ceremonial start to the Parc Ferme...hopefully they are at the same spot, that way I can just sticker up the car and leave it in the lot while I go find a nice pub.

Rallying sure will be a lot more fun without all that pesky driving! Cheaper, too! And my time with 15minutes penalty is still likely to be faster than if I actually run the rally. Bah! Who wants to risk all that damage and injury! Yes, I think placing midpack from my barstool is the way to go.

What kind of car would YOU like to not drive in a WRC rally? Go ahead! It's okay. Everyone's doing it.

FIA Dipshits.
 

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Eric, It is 5 minutes per stage missed, not leg.

So actually, you'd lose a ton of time. :)

Obviously, I am in the minority, but I really dig superally.

Think about it from a privateer standpoint.

You spend $250,000 for that weekend, and break a driveshaft. Superally lets you re-enter, get value for your sponsors, and increase your experience. Otherwise, you would be back at the hotel, trying to convice your marketing partners that yes, they should give you another quarter mil for Cyprus, or whatever, and rally is a good investment.
 

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1973 WRC POR
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>You spend $250,000 for that weekend

Matt:

Does that not tell you that something is wrong with the WRC?

Doug Woods
 

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>Think about it from a privateer standpoint.
>
>You spend $250,000 for that weekend, and break a driveshaft.
>Superally lets you re-enter, get value for your sponsors, and
>increase your experience. Otherwise, you would be back at the
>hotel, trying to convice your marketing partners that yes,
>they should give you another quarter mil for Cyprus, or
>whatever, and rally is a good investment.


If you are at the WRC level, you had damn well better be beyond the point of "needing experience".

I can see putting cars back out there to give the fans something to watch.

Should those re-entrants have a shot at winning? Fark no.
 

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I have a cat.
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>If you are at the WRC level, you had damn well better be
>beyond the point of "needing experience".
>
>I can see putting cars back out there to give the fans
>something to watch.
>
>Should those re-entrants have a shot at winning? Fark no.

Well said.

Also, if you are at WRC level, you'd better not be financing "race to race"...you'd better have more funds secured than that. If its a one off thing where you saved up for the event, then you'd better have your strategy in mind before the race...make it count and not crash, or go balls out and take the risk. Success in rallying is and HAS ALWAYS BEEN the proper balance between these strategies

This ain't no video game.
 

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>Eric, It is 5 minutes per stage missed, not leg.
>
>So actually, you'd lose a ton of time. :)
>
>Obviously, I am in the minority, but I really dig superally.
>
>Think about it from a privateer standpoint.
>
>You spend $250,000 for that weekend, and break a driveshaft.
>Superally lets you re-enter, get value for your sponsors, and
>increase your experience. Otherwise, you would be back at the
>hotel, trying to convice your marketing partners that yes,
>they should give you another quarter mil for Cyprus, or
>whatever, and rally is a good investment.

Yeah, I believe it was implemented mainly for experience for the younger drivers.

It was only monte carlo of this year when someone who used the superrally rules actually placed on the podium.

I think it's good; crash out on day one. Still get to compete (as long as you didn't destroy the car too bad). Although the 5minutes does seem a little strange.

Maybe 5minutes per stage, then the last 2 stages count as 10min penalties.

Good stuff, but ya still kinda shady when someone crashes out and then fights back to the podium (although that fight back was sure as hell impressive). Marcus did it last year in italy I believe, and loeb in mexico?
 

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>Maybe 5minutes per stage, then the last 2 stages count as
>10min penalties.

It is 5 minutes a stage.

I dont know what the big deal is. This is top level sport. The #1 factor here is money.

In order to bring in money, and do the promotion thing you need cars on the road. This is a good way to put them back on the road. Everyone has the same rules, so whats the problem?

The WRC isnt rallying from the 1970's, with tulips and 7 day events. It is a commercial and sporting empire, and ISC needs to do what is neccesary to keep the championship exciting and viable.

Ideally, yea, I would prefer 35 competitive WRC entrants in each event so we wouldnt need to re-enter to have enough cars to make it exciting, but we dont have that, so this is a good second best.

From a young-driver standpoint, superally is a mint as crap. I wish RA had superrally (And alot of other stuff, but whatever). It allows one to go flat-out and not worry as much about DNF'ing. You learn faster when you push 100% and you look cooler too.

Perhaps my example above wasnt the best one. Let's not use a top-level driver, lets say your a younger fella with a limited budget driving say, a 2wd GpN car. You have JUST enough money to compete in 4 or so events, and have to impress everyone, and all your marketing partners. You've invited say, 17 VIP's to enjoy the beaches and exciting rally action of Rally Sardinia or something. So you have all these people that came all this way to hobnob and see some action, and alot of $$$$ is on the line, and you lose a coil-pack on stage 3 or some stupid crap.

3 years ago, your done. Everyone go home, and maybe the VIP's wont have as much fun because they were waiting at the speccie area for you to come by, and missed the catered brunch and are grumpy, and now your career is over, etc.. etc..

But of course it works good for top-level guys too. Think of all those french fans that were in Monte Carlo waiting for seb, with their flags and hats, and Viva Le Seb banners and crap. They would all be super bummed if they didnt get to see WRC's new hotness playboy, and might tell their friends "Hey man, we spent all that time to go down to MC and didnt even see seb, sunday was boring as crap, next time, were spending our $$ on F1" or some stupid stuff like that. Then sponsors are like "WTF?" and the fans split, and so on and so forth.

WRC isnt about HUGE endurance and length anymore, that's what rally-raids are for.
 

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>The WRC isnt rallying from the 1970's,
>with tulips and 7 day events.

Unfortunately


>It is a commercial and sporting empire....

Thus it is a real tragedy.



>...lets say your a younger fella with a limited
>budget driving say, a 2wd GpN car. You have JUST enough money
>to compete in 4 or so events, and have to impress everyone,
>and all your marketing partners. You've invited say, 17 VIP's
>to enjoy the beaches and exciting rally action of Rally
>Sardinia or something. So you have all these people that came
>all this way to hobnob and see some action, and alot of $$$$
>is on the line, and you lose a coil-pack on stage 3 or some
>stupid crap.

He/she should go play in F1 if they want to impress people. He/she can have their personal stylist blow their hair and give them a manicure while their VIPs are being impressed


>WRC isnt about HUGE endurance and length anymore...

And that is exactly why I don't give a crap if WRC is ever on TV again.
 

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>And that is exactly why I don't give a crap if WRC is ever on
>TV again.

Well thats fine, sports evolve and change. Everything does.

In the 50's, F1 cars only had lap belts, and leather helmets. I bet that was more "exciting" as well.

Lots of people dont like the fact that music doesnt sound grainy like it used to on LP's, whatever.

That's the way things work. There is the RAC revival rally if you want old-school, and thats cool too.

Me and the other 768 million rally fans will be watching WRC.
 

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>I can see putting cars back out there to give the fans
>something to watch.
>
>Should those re-entrants have a shot at winning? Fark no.
>
>
That is the point!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

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>But of course it works good for top-level guys too. Think of
>all those french fans that were in Monte Carlo waiting for
>seb, with their flags and hats, and Viva Le Seb banners and
>crap. They would all be super bummed if they didnt get to see
>WRC's new hotness playboy, and might tell their friends "Hey
>man, we spent all that time to go down to MC and didnt even
>see seb, sunday was boring as crap, next time, were spending
>our $$ on F1" or some stupid stuff like that. Then sponsors
>are like "WTF?" and the fans split, and so on and so forth.
>
If they only came to see Seb, that's not the kind of fans the sport needs. They'll go away as soon as Seb isn't there (for one reason or the other).
 

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don't cut
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>If they only came to see Seb, that's not the kind of fans the
>sport needs. They'll go away as soon as Seb isn't there (for
>one reason or the other).

Danica Patrick is single handedly floating the IRL. Rally GB tickets sales jumped 25% when McCrae entered. Dale JR is mentioned in every NASCAR article whether he wins, crashes, or just plain sucks. There will always be a necessary contingent of fans that are "star struck", and that contingent is significantly big enough that it needs to be catered too.

My take on Superally? They should be allowed to continue racing, but not for position or points. For any professional team, the marketing aspect cannot be ignored.


Dennis Martin
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920-432-4845
 

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Mä meen vittu sinne!
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I think that they are allowed to still place is based upon the desire to have a result still. I think 5 minutes per stage is a fair penalty. If they can climb very far back up the leader board with a 5 minute penalty they probably deserve to be up there. Remember Petter's climb last year, in I think it was New Zealand?

There will always be people fanatical about one person, or for that matter, one version of rally. We see it here with people who don't care about rally anymore now that it's not a gazillion miles (though those still exist, they just are marketed towards rich privateers). If we're lucky Travis will bring in some fanatical fans that will last long after he's gone.
 
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