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Discussion Starter #1
Seems to me that starting in 2000 RIC wanted to become an FIA rally. Went to 3 days of reccee' and 3 days of rallying.

I took 6 vacation days to do that rally. I trashed a set of tires on our "reccee vehicle". Had crew drive up mid-week etc. By far the most expensive and demanding rally I've ever run.

Then starting in 2002 was it that Rally De' Quebec went full reccee' and everyone said "BUT THE FIA NEEDS A SNOW RALLY"!. I choose to not do the reccee' as time was the problem. Of course we got killed on times because we didn't do this.

Now Mexico got the WRC event and both Classic Canadian rallies are GONE!?

So what's going on? Did the events go bankrupt or what?

The CARS schedule looks kind of soft with these events gone:

- No Voyageurs
- No Quebec winter carnival rally
- No RIC

Is Defi' next to drop in a year or two?

Maybe going with FIA sanctioning and Full Reccee' wasn't the best thing after all.

Brian
 

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>
>Now Mexico got the WRC event and both Classic Canadian
>rallies are GONE!?
>
>So what's going on? Did the events go bankrupt or what?
>

I don't pretend to know the answer, but I wonder if the words: 'Corona' and 'ExportA' have anything to do with it.

These seem to be dark days for Canadian Motorsport don't they?

Robin
 

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In addition to the two rallies not happening, there was a post on the French rally forum today that Sylvain Erickson is retiring from rallying and will be circuit racing next year.

Doug Woods
 

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I also heard somewhere that Pat R got a major sponsorship offer from Ford and will be trading in his Subaru shirt to go CASCAR racing next year.




.......ok, so I made that bit up. While it is unfortunate that these rallies have been cancelled, I really doubt it has a lot to do with accepting the FIA standards, more to do with just being in the wrong economy, at the wrong time.
 

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I dont think sponsorship is the real or the mane reason....

those 2 event wer in BIG BIG deficite for he last fiew year...i dont know what happen....but they lost alots of money somewere...

from what we can hear.... its mostly becose of abuse and bad management...

of course...wen your business loose alot of money 3 year in a row and your rally are some that have the lowest entry.......it dosent look to good to atract sponsorship...especialy from goverment...hoo would give money to a company that loose money every year ?


its a real shame....many rally manage to make very succesfull event whit maybe 20% of the money those 2 rally ad...

they have people on a payroll, a real office...and more money than the Quebec féderation or even CARS....they really skrew up somewere...



Alain Lavoie
24Rallyteam
http://www.abikeonline.com/24rallyteam/
 

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>Has the 2004 CARS schedule been posted anywhere?

A version of it was posted at St Agathe during registration. Only notable difference was Quebec was missing.

Adding recce is not to blame for cancellation of the rallies. The cost to an organizer of offering a recce are minimal. Roads are not closed, very few volunteer registration and control workers are needed, no recconasiance books provided (just the routebooks to transit around during recce with), ... It could be argued less teams have been entering because of the increased cost and length of time involved that has hurt the rallies.

Rumors I've heard is that some 'international' rallies have taken at their expense, large congregations of officials to observe WRC events and either paid or helped pay with the expenses of foriegn teams to enter events. If true, how much has that cost them I wonder?

Well, without Charlevoix this year there is a week of vacation I can use elsewhere and a wad of cash I can spend doing something else. Somewhere tropical sounds good for October.:D
 

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Discussion Starter #9
The downside to the Reccee' events and such is EXACTLY time.

When registration and tech are days before the actual rally, etc...these days are killing peoples schedule also.

Everyone out there generally has a job with a given amount of time off.

The more time each rally starts taking the less rallies you compete in.

Then the entries drop and the rally doesn't understand? "But we're putting on a big show!"

I don't care about the bells & whistles or the show.

Give me the roads and let me rally. Route books are OK at best. If you want to go with provided Stage notes that's great to (Jemba) but full reccee' only adds time.

I can always find more credit. I cannot find more time.

Brian
 

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Decreasing entries due to having a recce offered is not to blame. Rallye de Quebec had plenty of entries this year. Entry fees are sometimes only a small portion of the revenue generated toward the event. Charlevoix was getting tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars from Quebec. Our entry fees no where matched the money given to them by the providence or sponsors. The question is was no one soliciting for it this year until apparently now?
 

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This makes me wonder ... did either ACP or Dave get buyers for their pacenotes at Defi? what was the 'client' response at the end of the event?
Would competitors pay a higher mandatory entry fee to subsidize the jemba notes, even on a full recce rally? If you were offered the chance to do either Jemba notes or Recce at the same rally which would you do ...
how 'bout this
Rally entry fee $X00 - gives you basic route book
Stage notes (jemba) - $200 (just for arguments sake)
Recce Registration - $200

Just a thought ...
 

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Having been a National event organizer, guys, I can tell you that it was not mismanagement of funds that killed the events.

The cost to put on these events has skyrocketed in recent years, and the income generated just has not kept pace.

The cost of insurance has skyrocketed (entire events were put on in the early 80's for the cost of just the insurance payment today).
The demands on organizers to provide this, that and the other thing to "put on a good show for the TV cameras and sponsors" has skyrocketed.
The 5 Year Plan costs money to implement at each event.
The new Safety Plan has hugely increased costs to events.
The Route Notes cost money that just isn't totally recouped in entry fees.
The extra days involved with the recce do cost extra money.
Putting events on the international calendar costs a lot of money.
Those trips to other events in the world are expensive, even when trying to keep costs to a bare minimum. (Those trips are necessary requirements, by the way, of the FIA, if they want the events to advance on the international calendar).
Quebec events have to put up miles and miles of snow fencing and tape to direct and control spectators.

The list goes on and on and on. This is not a new phenomena. This is not a problem that has cropped up in the last 2 years from route notes, recces, international events, or other changes. It's an on-going problem that has steadily built up over a long period of time, with each new item adding one more nail in the coffin.

Please, let's not start a witch-hunt on the organizers. They are doing the best possible job they can, under very trying conditions, putting MONTHS of long hours and a TON of effort into their events so that YOU GUYS (the competitors) can have fun. I even know of one organizer who, when the event ran out of money, used his own Visa card to keep the event afloat, and did not recoup his "sponsorship". These ladies and gentlemen exhibit extreme dedication to the sport they love, and they do not do it for the money, by any stretch of the imagination.

The least we can do at a time like this is show them our appreciation, our understanding, and our support, not pitchforks and flaming torches.......

Dave Sharp
Proud past (and future) organizer of the Bighorn Rally
 

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I agree with the Zipper on the plight of event organizers. And although lower entries at Charlevoix may well have been a factor I doubt they were the deal-breaker. It's about the big sponsors vs. the rising costs. Let's hope we find a way out of this spiral of upward costs and downward sponsorships.

ACP
Flirting with the laws of physics.
 
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