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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
If we are a club, that supports itself via membership monies, race fees, etc. then we, as members should have a vote in the cancelation rally events our club sanctions. I agree that the change is a good thing for rally in general, but there is still a matter of principle here. As a club memeber I was unaware there were any discusions about the posibility of my club dropping rally. I have a vested interest in the decisions that my club makes with regaurds to rally. I joined this particular club to help promote and forward my intrests and rally racing general.

I wonder if we signed our something that gives us no rights in the decisions our club makes. Might there be grounds for a lawsuit or something?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
RE: Were was the

I think you mean PRB...but did you know this was comming? We have a vehicle to communicate to the us members...it's called the Fast Track. I have not seen any mention of the possibility of losing rally through our club.
 

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your other left, you idiot
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RE: Were was the

Well, you did vote for your Division's representative on the BoD. So you could have expressed your opinion to him/her before the vote (that is, if you knew about it ahead of time - I didn't).

Kind of like voting for your Representative or Senator.

Could you sue them? Sure. You can sue anybody for anything (and that is a BIG part of the problem). Would you win?

Now, do you think that the results would have been different if this proposal was put to EACH of SCCA's memebers? I doubt it.

press on,
 

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RE: Were was the

>I think you mean PRB...but did you know this was coming? We
>have a vehicle to communicate to the us members...it's
>called the Fast Track. I have not seen any mention of the
>possibility of losing rally through our club.

We didn't know it was coming. We got no advance notice, the press release was the first we heard of it.

Ben
Soon to be ex-PRB

(edit to change one word)
 

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RE: Were was the

>Now, do you think that the results would have been different
>if this proposal was put to EACH of SCCA's memebers? I
>doubt it.
>
>press on,

I still don't think that takes away the right to the democratic process, even if you "know" the outcome.
 

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RE: Were was the

>Well, you did vote for your Division's representative on the
>BoD. So you could have expressed your opinion to him/her
>before the vote (that is, if you knew about it ahead of time
>- I didn't).
>
>Kind of like voting for your Representative or Senator.
>
>Could you sue them? Sure. You can sue anybody for anything
>(and that is a BIG part of the problem). Would you win?
>
>Now, do you think that the results would have been different
>if this proposal was put to EACH of SCCA's memebers? I
>doubt it.
>
>press on,

What would you sue for? Because you can't race anymore? Lets be realistic about this. It happened lets move on. All these post complaining about this subject are not going to make PRB change their minds. Things will work themselves out. Their are to many people in this sport for it to just vanish.
 

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> Might there be grounds for a lawsuit or something?

That type of attitude is the whole reason we are in this situation.
please take it somewhere else.

We could use positive input as to "our" direction now instead.

I agree on the frustration of being called a "club member" but SCCA and the "club" member side of it never really existed in any decisions, as far as looking for our input.
So there is no use in pissing and moaning about it now.

B~
 

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RE: Were was the

>Lets work toward the future and make sure that any current
>or future rally sanctioning bodies will have these
>democratic processes.

I keep hearing about how rally should be run by a democratic process.

What successful racing series is run by a democratic process? All the ones I can think of are run by (benevolent?) dictators.

If we can come up with one, let's look at it.

Ben
 

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RE: Were was the

>>Lets work toward the future and make sure that any current
>>or future rally sanctioning bodies will have these
>>democratic processes.
>
>I keep hearing about how rally should be run by a democratic
>process.
>
>What successful racing series is run by a democratic
>process? All the ones I can think of are run by
>(benevolent?) dictators.
>
>If we can come up with one, let's look at it.
>
>Ben
You might look at where rallying is a mass participation sport, I would suggest looking in Northern Europe.
Oddly enough, those countries are also strongly democratic and open in their governmental and press practices.

More important in successful series than the cliched 'dictator' argument is a simple and clear rules set governing AND limiting the class<<SINGULAR.
Nobody ever sat in the stands at a BTTC or Nascar race and wondered what class the guy in 17th place is in.

One Big Class
One Big drive axle





John Vanlandingham
Seattle, WA. 98168

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat!
Vive Le Groupe F!
 

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RE: Were was the

You might be right, but it sounds good doesn't it? :)

Anyway, doesn't CARS operate somewhat more democratically than the SCCA rally program did? Don't they run rules changes by the competitors first? I had heard that. Also, are their board members elected?

Finally, there's the old concept that just because it hasn't been done before it doesn't mean it couldn't work. I agree that certain decisions should be made by a dictator (safety, finances, etc), but there are others that should be put to a vote by the affected parties (car age limits, etc).
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I guess i need to put a smiley face or something so someone might get the joke...come on guys. Insurance rates go up do to lawsuits lawsuits lead to increased costs...it was a joke!! If ti was'nt for lawsuits we would not be in "this" predicament. The term "Club" needs to be out of a race series all together. We should not have a vote, it should be benevolent dictatorship owned by someone. Like NASCAR, Best in the Desert, etc. A democratic process would slow the whole thing down too much. It should be a for profit thing that is how America works. The viability of that needs to be worked out somehow...my brain is too tiny for that.
 

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> We should not have a vote, it should be
>benevolent dictatorship owned by someone.

Who would you trust?
There is no single person that I would trust, and it is too big a job for any one person.

>A democratic process would slow the
>whole thing down too much.

Actually, that is one of the benefits of democracy, it slows the entire process down. Yeah, everything gets debated to death, and that's how you weed out the bad ideas, like age limits, 22mm restrictors, and those silly diagonal bars right behind the seats.

>It should be a for profit thing
>that is how America works.

That doesn't make it right. I would never send my money to a for-profit sanctioning body unless there was profit cap AND the books were public record. There sure as hell better not be somebody getting rich off of my hobby.
 

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RE: Were was the

>
>What successful racing series is run by a democratic
>process? All the ones I can think of are run by
>(benevolent?) dictators.

Isn't that what alot of us were mad at Kurt Spitzner for trying to be? Or was he just not good enough at the whole benevolent dictator thing? I just want to know how the people at GRM like working with ol' Kurt...


Nick Polimeni
[email protected]
www.odysseyhouseonline.com
www.hrm-usa.com
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
WOWSERS...Conspiracy Theorists unite! Yeah man noone anywhere should make money off my hobby either. Like the cars I buy and the tires and the roll cage tubing and gas and etc. Come on dude...lighten up. If it ran like a bussiness by a bussiness person it be made into a viable entity on its own. There is a demand in the US and someone will meet the demand. But if you want someone to do all the work and not reap any benefit (ie. $$$$) you are out of touch. Even better, since non-profit is up your alley, why don't you go for it. Start a huge process that all of vote on everything that gets done and do it all for free. Sounds fun huh?!?
 

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SURF!!! I'll cover you myself!
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>WOWSERS...Conspiracy Theorists unite! Yeah man noone
>anywhere should make money off my hobby either. Like the
>cars I buy and the tires and the roll cage tubing and gas
>and etc. Come on dude...lighten up. If it ran like a
>bussiness by a bussiness person it be made into a viable
>entity on its own. There is a demand in the US and someone
>will meet the demand. But if you want someone to do all the
>work and not reap any benefit (ie. $$$$) you are out of
>touch. Even better, since non-profit is up your alley, why
>don't you go for it. Start a huge process that all of vote
>on everything that gets done and do it all for free. Sounds
>fun huh?!?


yeah
 
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