As many saw in Ct the time between Higgins and Kulig was very close. The rally could have had a differnt out come if the Scca would use some of the $80,000 entry money to get professional rally timing. The sport cannot grow if it isn't done properly.
The Scca and its problems.
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Professional Timing?
WHAT?
Professional Rally Timing?
We don't need no stinking Professional Rally Timing!
(Long live the "Pro-le-Ralliat" :+ )
WHAT?
Professional Rally Timing?
We don't need no stinking Professional Rally Timing!
(Long live the "Pro-le-Ralliat" :+ )
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19 Posts
I confess! I took it and spent it on new carpet for my '83 GTI! You'd be surprised how expensive mink carpeting can be! 
...0ran...
...0ran...
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>As many saw in Ct the time between Higgins and Kulig was
>very close. The rally could have had a differnt out come if
>the Scca would use some of the $80,000 entry money to get
>professional rally timing. The sport cannot grow if it
>isn't done properly.
John Vanlandingham
Geeeze duuuude, can't you add? 76 'Pro' x 800 approx is $56,800
5 'Mfg' x 900 appros is $ 4,500
22 'Club'x 600 approx is $13,200
--------
If they were all advance entr. $74,500
So your totally irresponsible attack of the people putting on this rally is PROVEN to be a WILD and IRRESPONSIBLE claim, and your point about using hollow drums, smoke signals, flares from Verry Pistols, pulling the tail feathers of macaws, and the other methods people used is thereby deemed MOOT and not worthy of a polite response.
Where is the angry guy to put you in your place?
>very close. The rally could have had a differnt out come if
>the Scca would use some of the $80,000 entry money to get
>professional rally timing. The sport cannot grow if it
>isn't done properly.
John Vanlandingham
Geeeze duuuude, can't you add? 76 'Pro' x 800 approx is $56,800
5 'Mfg' x 900 appros is $ 4,500
22 'Club'x 600 approx is $13,200
--------
If they were all advance entr. $74,500
So your totally irresponsible attack of the people putting on this rally is PROVEN to be a WILD and IRRESPONSIBLE claim, and your point about using hollow drums, smoke signals, flares from Verry Pistols, pulling the tail feathers of macaws, and the other methods people used is thereby deemed MOOT and not worthy of a polite response.
Where is the angry guy to put you in your place?
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265 Posts
>if the Scca would use some of the $80,000 entry money to get
>professional rally timing.
The SCCA did not put on the rally. They only sanctioned it. Rally Organizers must arrange for their own equipment.
Cheez! Next you'll want to PAY the workers, too!
>professional rally timing.
The SCCA did not put on the rally. They only sanctioned it. Rally Organizers must arrange for their own equipment.
Cheez! Next you'll want to PAY the workers, too!
I don't know if I'm the angry guy or not, but John, I'm gonna agree with you! If the heavens & earth open up and the world flushes itself, so be it Keep these young whippersnappers in their place and teach them proper math. We'll educate them later on insurance, sanctioning fees, NFS Road fees, etc. etc. etc. Besides, my sun dial is still working like a top!
David McDaniel
"Um, Brian, is the gas supposed to pour out from underneath the car like that?"
Keep these young whippersnappers in their place and teach them proper math. We'll educate them later on insurance, sanctioning fees, NFS Road fees, etc. etc. etc. Besides, my sun dial is still working like a top!David McDaniel
"Um, Brian, is the gas supposed to pour out from underneath the car like that?"
From a worker: Equipment for the rally
Just to let you in on a little tid bit.(this is not to be smart but just bringing up a point) Rally promotions did as much as they could budget for. We reused signs from last years rally (The ones that no one ran over or swiped!) and still had workers making signs the week before the rally! The Ham operators brought there own equipment for the stage to net control communication, for the stage start and finish communications we used FRS radios from other regions, and other regions and a competitor brought clocks. You just have to think about a couple of things yes we may have taken in 74,000, but it takes much more to make the rally run. As for the pay for workers, all I can say is that everyone needs to be glad that we rally crazed people are out busting our tails and rounding up equipment or there would be no ralling for anyone. You can't tell me that the other rallies except for the WRC have perfect timing systems. Unfortunatly the Chattanooga Region is a small region and has small amounts of bodies and equipment. Most other regions that have prorally have extremely large amounts of bodies and money. So please take under consideration that we are doing our best with what we have. Just give us a chance to grow. You can't tell me the WRC was perfect in its rising years.Everyone has to start somewhere!
JJ
Just to let you in on a little tid bit.(this is not to be smart but just bringing up a point) Rally promotions did as much as they could budget for. We reused signs from last years rally (The ones that no one ran over or swiped!) and still had workers making signs the week before the rally! The Ham operators brought there own equipment for the stage to net control communication, for the stage start and finish communications we used FRS radios from other regions, and other regions and a competitor brought clocks. You just have to think about a couple of things yes we may have taken in 74,000, but it takes much more to make the rally run. As for the pay for workers, all I can say is that everyone needs to be glad that we rally crazed people are out busting our tails and rounding up equipment or there would be no ralling for anyone. You can't tell me that the other rallies except for the WRC have perfect timing systems. Unfortunatly the Chattanooga Region is a small region and has small amounts of bodies and equipment. Most other regions that have prorally have extremely large amounts of bodies and money. So please take under consideration that we are doing our best with what we have. Just give us a chance to grow. You can't tell me the WRC was perfect in its rising years.Everyone has to start somewhere!
JJ
Jamie:
Good for you!
And to let you know most rallies are in the same boat as Cherokee. There are one or two that are making money and they tend to give some of it back to the competitors or reinvest in the event.
To the readers, and original poster:
This thread started with an attack on the SCCA, that used CT's budget as an example. There are many legitimate complaints about the SCCA and each event. However there are many, many more attacks that are not well thought out and end up sounding ignorant.
Each rally on the series would like to be run at the level of a WRC event. Very few people in the US make any money on Rally, many spend money that would be better saved in their 401k.
The suggestion goes out: ASK QUESTIONS, GET INVOLVED, then make suggestions.
AND FYI: timing systems are being discussed for the series, if the NPR events should be able to afford a system you'll see them it in the future.
See you in the woods,
Mike
Good for you!
And to let you know most rallies are in the same boat as Cherokee. There are one or two that are making money and they tend to give some of it back to the competitors or reinvest in the event.
To the readers, and original poster:
This thread started with an attack on the SCCA, that used CT's budget as an example. There are many legitimate complaints about the SCCA and each event. However there are many, many more attacks that are not well thought out and end up sounding ignorant.
Each rally on the series would like to be run at the level of a WRC event. Very few people in the US make any money on Rally, many spend money that would be better saved in their 401k.
The suggestion goes out: ASK QUESTIONS, GET INVOLVED, then make suggestions.
AND FYI: timing systems are being discussed for the series, if the NPR events should be able to afford a system you'll see them it in the future.
See you in the woods,
Mike
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As a Chattanooga Region member, and a co-driver (and a former worker and will-be worker when I can't get a right seat ride (or a left seat one)), let me say that I am simply astounded that the Chatt region gets the workers that it does. We are a small SCCA region (under 100 members) on the verge of being I guess a medium (100+ members) region. We get over 50 members at our monthly meetings! That's not like my old region, which will go unnamed, which might get 15-20 members at a good meeting, with a much larger membership.
Regardless, the point to be made is that we are an activist region when it comes to rally, and folks like RallyGal are the ones to thank. Additionally, Kendall and John are (IMHO) (along with Bill Perry, and the folks who put together Sandhills), the reason for the resurgence of rally in the SE-DIV.
Rally Promotions does not make money on its ventures. It does put on one heck of a rally, regardless of the "negatives" voiced regarding spectators, Forest Service, or other problems. Additionally, the club "scene" here could not work without Kendall and John either, who are tireless promoters of the sport.
I'm sure glad I moved to Chattanooga!
Wilson
P.S. Just wait 'til you see our upcoming rallycross/rallysprint series and site! Hold on to your hats.
Regardless, the point to be made is that we are an activist region when it comes to rally, and folks like RallyGal are the ones to thank. Additionally, Kendall and John are (IMHO) (along with Bill Perry, and the folks who put together Sandhills), the reason for the resurgence of rally in the SE-DIV.
Rally Promotions does not make money on its ventures. It does put on one heck of a rally, regardless of the "negatives" voiced regarding spectators, Forest Service, or other problems. Additionally, the club "scene" here could not work without Kendall and John either, who are tireless promoters of the sport.
I'm sure glad I moved to Chattanooga!
Wilson
P.S. Just wait 'til you see our upcoming rallycross/rallysprint series and site! Hold on to your hats.
In order for rally to grow in the US the Scca needs to get tag timing. People in Europe find US rally pitiful and to many after CT it is. How can a group N car beat a factory WRC Subaru. The main reason the Scca should get tag timing is because in order for people all over world to come to the US to run a FIA rally like CT the rally has to be done accurately.
HEY I GOT AN IDEA why dont YOU buy the timing system as the "Official Timing Sponsor of the SCCA"
In the last few forums Ive seen I dont think you had one positive thing to say about CT or your experience in Chattanooga. There again as rally gal stated WRC started somewhere. AND AS I STATED IN OTHER FOURMS THE RALLY STARTED EXCATLY ON TIME! Way to go ALL WOMEN STAGE TEAM!!!
Since you seem crtical of the way things happened @ CT. I have a question for you? HAVE YOU ORGANIZED A RALLY?
We are all trying to do with what we got for the love of our sport!!!!!!
-Scott Dobler (chatt, region member)
Also proud to sign his "real" name @ the end of the message.
In the last few forums Ive seen I dont think you had one positive thing to say about CT or your experience in Chattanooga. There again as rally gal stated WRC started somewhere. AND AS I STATED IN OTHER FOURMS THE RALLY STARTED EXCATLY ON TIME! Way to go ALL WOMEN STAGE TEAM!!!
Since you seem crtical of the way things happened @ CT. I have a question for you? HAVE YOU ORGANIZED A RALLY?
We are all trying to do with what we got for the love of our sport!!!!!!
-Scott Dobler (chatt, region member)
Also proud to sign his "real" name @ the end of the message.
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430 Posts
TAG timing was at Laughlin and it was fantastic, they are interested in doing any ProRally this year, organizers should contact them at their website or talk to Ray Hocker on CRS forum.
RE: Professional Timing?
Timimg equipment is only as good as its set up and its operators. Good equipment run by untrained operators is useless. The controls at Cherokee trails were staffed by well trained workers who knew how to make the best scoring possible with the equipment they had to work with. While I would have prefered to use 1/100th minutes to provide more divisions, FIA requires timing in seconds. Threrefore, we set our equipment to operate in seconds.
We will be looking into the availability of other timing equipment in the future. However, anyone who has ever worked a finish control in the forest knows that this is not like timing an autocross. Just ask the gilrs that were out in the rain Saturday morning.
Thanks to all who helped work timing controls from Chattanooga Region SCCA and from the Georgia Sports car Club.
Mike Strawbridge
Timimg equipment is only as good as its set up and its operators. Good equipment run by untrained operators is useless. The controls at Cherokee trails were staffed by well trained workers who knew how to make the best scoring possible with the equipment they had to work with. While I would have prefered to use 1/100th minutes to provide more divisions, FIA requires timing in seconds. Threrefore, we set our equipment to operate in seconds.
We will be looking into the availability of other timing equipment in the future. However, anyone who has ever worked a finish control in the forest knows that this is not like timing an autocross. Just ask the gilrs that were out in the rain Saturday morning.
Thanks to all who helped work timing controls from Chattanooga Region SCCA and from the Georgia Sports car Club.
Mike Strawbridge
What is acurate?
The accepted human response time is about +/-.1 seconds. The most important thing is for each worker to be consistent. If their method is consistent then the what ever error there is consistant and can effectively be modeled out.
Yes a one second difference is close. But I'd argue that the whole second is still a significant digit, maybe not the tenth of a second, but definitely the whole second.
You could really start picking nits over the acutall length of the stage, the exact, precise location of the start and finsih lines... But, frankly, I don't care to bring up that arguement again....
jb
The accepted human response time is about +/-.1 seconds. The most important thing is for each worker to be consistent. If their method is consistent then the what ever error there is consistant and can effectively be modeled out.
Yes a one second difference is close. But I'd argue that the whole second is still a significant digit, maybe not the tenth of a second, but definitely the whole second.
You could really start picking nits over the acutall length of the stage, the exact, precise location of the start and finsih lines... But, frankly, I don't care to bring up that arguement again....
jb
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