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much to learn I have
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Greetings all!

First of all, I want to say hello since I'm brand new to the forum and that this is my first post! I hope you don't find my complete novice questions beneath you guys. =p

I've been interested in rallying for a few years now and am finally in a position where I can seriously consider buying a car and getting into this ridiculously fun-looking sport. Since I am a complete beginner, I've done plenty of due diligence by reading a lot of threads here and other places as to what to consider when buying a first car and whether or not to actually build one or buy a used, pre-prepped car. After considering the many options and opinions, I think I'm going to stick with a VW Golf and build it up myself, upgrading parts and such as I gain experience. I'm liking the idea of a non-turbo, FWD car to beat up and learn in for a while.

That said, are there specific model years that are better than others for rally? I've seen a lot of MkII's out there and I assume that newer model years start getting more expensive to run with spare parts and all. You can tell me if this is logical thinking, but I have a concern that investing in an older MkII might become frustrating since they are over 20 yrs old now and that getting parts will be increasingly difficult. So does a MkIII or MkIV make sense? Is there a sweet-spot for Golfs nowadays? How much would make sense to pay for any of these options?

I have a MkV GTI as my daily driver now and totally love it. I've thought about trying a few auto cross or rally cross events in that but I'd prefer not to mess it up by doing that.

Other general opinions and insights are more than welcome! Hope to see some of you around =)
 

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Welcome,

You can rallyX anything without messing it up, typically. I currently rallyX my Nissan Versa daily driver.

I have been told that MK I Golf/Rabbit's are not advisable for stage rally, the newer the better. See this thread for more info. http://www.specialstage.com/forums/showthread.php?61441-84-VW-Rabbit-GTI-build&highlight=

If you are looking to stage rally, read the threads about buying vs building. I would recommend buying over building just to get on stage quicker. I love building my project car and learning a ton about it, but I have missed and will miss a lot of chances for precious seat time this year.

This forum is a goldmine of advice and information from people that have a lot of experience in rally, if you ask and search.
 

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much to learn I have
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks for the replies! I figured the Mk1 wouldn't be wise for all the reasons those guys were saying in that other thread.

I saw that car in Washington. Looked like a decent buy from what I could tell. But that's so far awaaayyy. Thanks for the heads up though.

T
 

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Four tree two remember Andrew
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Thanks for the replies! I figured the Mk1 wouldn't be wise for all the reasons those guys were saying in that other thread.

I saw that car in Washington. Looked like a decent buy from what I could tell. But that's so far awaaayyy. Thanks for the heads up though.

T
Fly up, drive back over a selected route of gravel roads, have fun, live life!
 

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^^^^

I've driven my rally car on thousands of miles of dirt roads (maybe just hundreds) outside of stage rally. not at racing speeds or nothing, i tend to refer to it as "Adventure driving"

you should really consider flying out and buying a car . you'll really get to know the car on the way back.


Do you know how to weld? have you ever made a roll cage? if no, don't build.
do you have a close friend who can make you a roll cage and charge you no labor? if no , don't build.

If you're not doing the roll cage, but instead you are just going to change the bolt on parts (suspension) figure out lights and skid plates... might as well buy the cheapest used caged car, with a good cage and frame. then you can get right out onto the stage, but change the suspension and stuff out later. get some of that build experience but at a much cheaper cost. :)
 

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400 flat to crest
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`Looking quickly at Craigslist for what 190k cars are going for down there it would be beyond silly to not grab that one up in Oly Wa.
Highways are good its :
37 h
In current traffic: 38 h
Chattanooga, TN

2,583.9 m

Remember instant gratification is the most important thing so all these guys telling to buy a built car "cause you'll be on Stage sooner' are 100% right.

It really doesn't matter that you'll be on stage with a car with no power, a gearbox and final drive selected more maximum MPG horrible brakes, lilely weak and stupidly still and short travel suspension and that in all certainty that the biggest lesson you'll learn is just how unsuitable a MPG oriented car designed to go get groceries is when you attempt to go down a stage quickly..

Forget all that shit..

It is your god given right as a patriotic American to always have every wish--every whim--satisfied immediately...

Don't worry about results---with a stock engine and trans you won't be having any---just buy anything, tow. pay a big 650-850 buck entry and just motor along at 37 or 42mph...

You've satisfied your wish...

Aside from acceleration, who could ask foy anything more?

MkII, MkIII, or MkIV---using maybe Corrado front struts/hubs--would all be fine--infinitesimal weigh differences once stripped and prepped...

But check what real final drive ratios and a good reliable clutch-plate LSD costs to buy and install.
 

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much to learn I have
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Thanks for more replies! There's nothing worse than an in-active forum when you're trying to get questions answered.

Realistically it does make more sense to just buy a car. I'm not great at welding currently but I hadn't planned on making my own cage either. That's a professional's job. I don't want to get crunched inside a big hunk of metal. The more I look at it, that car up in WA is calling my name. We'll see about getting off work...

Cheers!
 

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400 flat to crest
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Thanks for more replies! There's nothing worse than an in-active forum when you're trying to get questions answered.
Truth is that with regards to actual working---and improving--club level cars for guys like you, there is orders of magnitude more and importantly much better information here. Detailed stuff. Concrete stuff. http://www.rallyanarchy.com/phorum/list.php?5

Realistically it does make more sense to just buy a car.
If the balance is right---everything is a cost vs benefit calculation...
In this case you like Golves, there's one for scarcely more than road cars in your area and all you need to do is scoot down the Great American Highway, pick it up.

BUT......think ahead---and in every aspect of rally from thinking about the "right' car, to planning work to make it reliable, to planning on making it it fun---top planning your first event to driving on stage---thinking ahead is always good...
So think ahead what the costs of making the Golf a) reliable and b) funner

And think what "funn-er" means

And I'll tell you right now in clear talk--screw all the other bullshit rationalizations---the most funn-er thing you can do is to get shorter final drive ratio of at least 4.47 and maybe better 4.63.....and a clutch plate LSD---like the nice one from Gripper Diffs---and those at the same time makes tons of sense since the box is all opened up---several hour job once pulled--so do it once...
With a 4.63--or whatever 4.67, modding the motor falls in importance cause the final drive multiplies whatever power the motor makes...
So start planning---and check the prices...cause those 2 absolutely vital things are going to cost several thousand dollars to get into the box.

I'm not great at welding currently but I hadn't planned on making my own cage either.
Learn.
Here's Lesson 1 thru one bazzillion: CLEAN BRIGHT NEWLY DISC-ED steel is easy to weld. CLEAN

That's a professional's job.
Absolutely not.. It must be done by somebody who is motivated and skilled---and honest about their skills and limitations... but 1000s of cages ---10s of thousands worldwide---have been built by owners or close friends/acquaintances, or similar..
But it must be right regardless.

Nothing we are doing has to be done by "professionals" except boring and crank grinds and valve grinds.



I don't want to get crunched inside a big hunk of metal.
Nobody does---planning ahead is good

The more I look at it, that car up in WA is calling my name.
Get moving the guy has to move.
Get Some!

Cheers![/QUOTE]
 

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Fun is where its at.. and what you find fun. Sure I haven't hit a stage yet, sure I'm still working on my car (4 years in the making), sure its a soot powered beast, sure I have the wrong gear ratio's and way too much torque. But I have a ton of fun building stuff and I've had zero budget for actually hitting a stage so alls well.

The Golf in Wa is perfect.. if you don't get it then consider a mk3 or 4. The 2's are just too old unless you have a few parts cars to get body panels from. The mk3's are basically the same with slightly more heft, slightly wider track, a stronger shell and there are a ton of them around. The down side (around here in NE) they all rust. When I say basically the same, you can unbolt the underpinnings from a mk3 and bolt it into a mk2 bar the front engine cross member with relative ease.

My buddies are just starting to look into mk4's as they don't suffer as much from the rust, but we're unsure if they offer an real benefit over the 3's... except they are ridiculously cheap right now around here... between a few of them they've bought 3 mk4 gti's for an average of 600 a piece, how can you go wrong.

Now sure they (golfs) are pricey to fit into JVL's rally formula, nothing wrong with the formula, its supposedly a ton of fun and loved by many. Just sus out what makes you happy, what fun is to you, and how deep you want to go. There are more opinions around here than trees in the forest, but most wood can build strong houses.

Rally on!!
 

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^^^
Great post there.

If you really like Building things and wrenching and you will truly enjoy the building / working on it aspect that's a big check mark for the build option.

Personally i hated a lot of my car wrenching time. esp early on when i knew nothing at all about how to work on a car. I'd much rather drive it broken, then actually fix it. so for me buying is a much better option. (one i didn't do) I am very fortunate to have a lot of friends with great wrenching / welding skills so it all worked out in the end..

but ya .. what aspects will be fun to you? which ones won't?
 
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