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Discussion Starter #1
There was an interesting question raised on a now locked thread, I'll only mention what I find interesting and maybe someone can enlighten me.
When the PRD worked for 1yr. at another series in which he was brought in when it was badly failing, the PRD still was able to procure $500K sponsorship money for that series before the series demise. This is interesting to me,here is why:
Why is it that money can be had to run and promote a failing series, yet Pro Rally, a series on the grow with great marketing potential has now go without a national sponsor for 5 yrs. are we unmarketable?

It does accure to me that maybe the market is consider to be the manufacturers of automobiles. Yet that is such a small market in the world of advertizing that it makes little sense. NASCAR the series we are always told we should be modeled after has numerous other sponsors, and each team has large numbers of private sponsors plus the manufacturer of the so called car their driving.

How are we to decearse the finacial burden on the independed teams if we cannot get a series sponsor to help? Without the indpendent teams of today will we have a series tomorrow?

Please show me the light.

:+
 

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Unless I am very much mistaken, that is what KS was SUPPOSED to be doing. Not trying to re-write the rulebook on a whim every time he had an 'idea'

I am not sure that a pulse is even required to do a better job than he has done.

The guy should have been gone long ago.

Matt Manspeaker
Seattle, WA USA
89 323GTX - Open
 

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Discussion Starter #3
That aside (which I agree with.), is cattering to the "manufacturers council" hindering the sport from getting a national sponsor? In other words how can we deal with the manufacturers wants and have a national sponsor without having a conflict of interest?
I would think the manufacturers would want a national sponsor. Would't that help to get their products in a larger advertising base while deferring costs? Would not a national sponsor benefit from written and photograph media coverage while also showing off the auto manufacturers products and or achivements/results?
 

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Maybe the manufacturers dont want a title sponsor so they can control the series? If lets say, Budwiser becomes the title sponsor they most likely wont want to pay for a series that is little more than a multi event infomercial for Mit-suba-dai with the racing as secondary which is what we have now. It is clear to me why there is not a sponsor, because one is not wanted by the powers that be.
 

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Sean Tennis said: "Show me the light."
Whassa matta Sean? Feeling a little too much like that mushroom? I have been feeling like I have been kept in the dark and fed poo for entirely too long too. You and I both know darned well that the only reason that we don't have a national sponsor is that guys like you and I won't (couldn't be that we have to WORK for a living) pony up the dough for that brand new (read:MARKETABLE in someone's mind) car so that we can look just like everybody else out there and therefore justify the exposure.
I'm certain that plenty of you will be glad to let me know that I am all wet here, but I seem to recall being told by quite a number of folks that they are excited to see those boreing lookalike cars get through so that they can get pelted with rocks thrown by cars like mine and that other (ugly) rear drive Volvo now being driven by one Jay Streets (Yer ugly too Jay....Nahh nahh!!!:p). This because they really enjoy the spectacle of a car being driven colorfully (if not particularly quickly) as this is EXCITING for the spectators!! Remember AD wonks.....The spectators are the folks getting all moist (remember---lots of rain in the Northwest, except this year) about the few sponsors products that we clubbin' guys are able to beg, borrow or steal. I certainly would be pleased to feel as though my guy in Topeka is actually thinking of how I could be out in the woods easier with less dough out of my pocket. But as I alluded to earlier, I am likely all wet. Thoughts?
John Lane
Viva Le Pro Le Ralliat
 

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The SCCA needs to introduce Performance Based Pay.

I find it works wonders at getting people motivated or gone.

The people who produce love it the ones who do not produce ##### wine and moan then quit. Very simple.

When did Kurt start 1997? so he managed not to land a sponsor during a time when business was incredibaly free with their cash, many businesses spent more in advertising during that time then they made in revenue. Is someone who could not get the job done during that time the right man for the job in a very tight market?

I say we make him 100% performanced based pay and find out.

Derek Bottles
Viva Le Pro Le Ralliat
 

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OK before reading what I write below, you need to know that I have not been satisfied with the implementation of the series sponsorship that has been obtained, nor do I find value in the SCCA corporate sponsors allowed to place stickers in the "protected" space (among other issues).

So generally I am not happy either.

BUT looking soley at what the PRD has brought to Performance Rally it is hard not to recognize 3 fully funded and committed Manufacturers, which pay for the SCCA ProRally TV series on Speedvision. (And Mazda and maybe Dodge will have significant contingency programs.)

It is hard not to recognize the large number of contingencey programs in place for the Performance Rally Community.

It is hard not to recognize the sheer Growth of the number of competitors at all levels, and it is hard not to recognize the increase in general awareness of Rally and the increased number of spectators at events.

All that being said it is also easy to recognize that the PRD bends very easily to accomadate the manufacturers (sponsers) and "big name" teams. It is hard to trust the PRDs intentions, it is hard to trust the PRDs control over the rules.

It is Hard to understand why we don't need continued if not increased series marketing support, but we do need a paid series manager, rule maker, dictator.

It is also hard to see the justification for the increased pressure to be "professional" and the added time and monetary investments that come with being professional without any direct benefit to the competitors, organizers, or membership at large. (Note that manufacturer involvement and TV are important indirect benefits to the Rally Community; contingencies, while great, are not really significant enough to elevate professionalism.)


So I think it is important to offer constructive critisism, I think it is important to let the BoD, the SCCA, the PRD, and the PRB all know that we don't think the Series Manager/PRD is working in the best interests of the membership, but we do think that the marketing increase is a tremendous benefit to the Club.

This formum gets off track so easily, and some of the issues need to be repeated and explained countless times for the good of the participants. All this is good, if not frustrating. So to the point of this thread: Remeber that all of the marketing brought in looks very good to the BoD and the corporate perspective of the SCCA.


So, How can we convey to the powers that be, that the we still see a need for a National Sponsor, that we see more of a value in continued and increased marketing support, and that we don't think that the PRB needs the PRDs help in managing the series?

Well one of the important parts of emphasising what we want is recognizing what we have and how it can be improved, grown, changed...

Some one else is controlling my light switch,
Mike
 

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RE: National Sponsor? (for a fan driven series)

What you are saying in regards to the fans excitment at seeing some of the more unusual cars in the series follows the "Nascar Formula" that I believe was mentioned earlier in this discussion. i.e. Nascar is a fan driven series. The fans want to see cars run close together with tight finishes and big wrecks. which the drivers always gripe about. So if I had a point I guess it is what can be done to get more fans out to see a rally. Are there any US rallies that include Super Special Stages that are fan friendly like the WRC uses?

So a fan driven series would be more likely to attract national sponsors not involved in motor vehicles, like budweiser.
 

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RE: National Sponsor? (for a fan driven series)

>Are there any US rallies that include Super Special Stages that
>are fan friendly like the WRC uses?

The Ramada Express International Rally (Dec 13-15, 2002) has a SuperStage on Sunday that features side-by-side action. It's easy for the fans to check out, plus there are charity runs so they can ride in a rally car. Could be cold though.

[hr]

[p align=right]John Dillon
John @ WidgetRacing.com
www.WidgetRacing.com
 

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>It is hard not to recognize the sheer Growth of the number
>of competitors at all levels, and it is hard not to
>recognize the increase in general awareness of Rally and the
>increased number of spectators at events.

While I agree with your first two points, I don't think that the growth in public awareness of the sport was particularly affected by anyone at the SCCA. It had a lot more to do with increased marketing of the WRC, both directly and indirectly (video games in particular).
It is much easier to find people who are aware of rally because of the WRC promotion than it is to find people who have heard of the SCCA... I think that the awareness would have come regardless of the actions of the SCCA administration.

>It is Hard to understand why we don't need continued if not
>increased series marketing support, but we do need a paid
>series manager, rule maker, dictator.

Because no 'professional (i.e. for money)' racing series has survived without a dictator. I would not argue that our series is 'professional' or that it needs to be, though. It would have made a lot more sense (IMO) to run the 'professional (= manufacturers) part of the series as an additional level of the sport.

>It is also hard to see the justification for the increased
>pressure to be "professional" and the added time and
>monetary investments that come with being professional
>without any direct benefit to the competitors, organizers,
>or membership at large. (Note that manufacturer involvement
>and TV are important indirect benefits to the Rally
>Community; contingencies, while great, are not really
>significant enough to elevate professionalism.)

Especially when the majority of national competitors are 'club' competitors who want to run at a higher level of challenge, but who are limited by their (time and money) budgets by the fact that they have jobs/families/etc...

Adrian
 

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RE: National Sponsor - New News?

I have recently heard rumors that there will be a national sponsor next year and that there will be a new development that I think will be very positive, it is a major step in the right direction.

I am hopeful.

Derek Bottles
 

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Discussion Starter #12
RE: National Sponsor - New News?

I hope that the rumor of a national sponsor for 2003 is true and is done well by SCCA and not just another sticker for our cars. I don't mean to sound negative but my faith is not strong at this point.

I have to say that IMO the manufacturers buy in to the sport should have come with XXX amount of money required of them that had to be awarded to private teams for results achieved. IMO this would help promote use of their products and allow teams to be built. Of course the money would need to be a rather decent amount.

What brings me to this opinion is the large number of people who did invest in new cars as the PRD requested yet have not seen any positive return-only shrinking bank accounts.

I really am left to wonder how much thought as to how to grow our sport has been spent by the powers that be. I think I have a grasp of what is trying to be done however I'm not sure the powers understand what we truly are and the level that we are at, at this time. Somebody forgot to spend money on research and development of our sport!!!
 

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RE: National Sponsor - New News?

> I hope that the rumor of a national sponsor for 2003 is
>true and is done well by SCCA and not just another sticker
>for our cars. I don't mean to sound negative but my faith
>is not strong at this point.
>
> I have to say that IMO the manufacturers buy in to the
>sport should have come with XXX amount of money required of
>them that had to be awarded to private teams for results
>achieved. IMO this would help promote use of their products
>and allow teams to be built. Of course the money would need
>to be a rather decent amount.
>
> What brings me to this opinion is the large number of
>people who did invest in new cars as the PRD requested yet
>have not seen any positive return-only shrinking bank
>accounts.
>
> I really am left to wonder how much thought as to how to
>grow our sport has been spent by the powers that be. I
>think I have a grasp of what is trying to be done however
>I'm not sure the powers understand what we truly are and the
>level that we are at, at this time. Somebody forgot to
>spend money on research and development of our sport!!!

I think we have to really ask why the sport has grown.

Does it have anything at all to do with anything the SCCA has or hasn't done?

OR more likely, ESPN/SPEEDVISION coverage and allowing spectators at the events officially (as of 1997) on its own without SCCA doing a thing?

What we need is some real contingencies that allow about 1/3 of the field to break even on a weekend, and not just the 4wd turbo cars.
 
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