>It's a real one--not a kit. Asking $50k. Good for vintage
>rally--if you could bear to thrash such a pretty jewel...
I needn't worry about trashing such a dandy piece since I don't fit in them well enough to ever drive one! Last time I sat behind the steering wheel of a Stratos it took two guys helping to get my knees unwedged from under the dash! The cockpits in those cars are tiny!
I've been told that the owner of this one has been known to claim it was the real thing but I have no personal experience in the matter. I originally saw the car for sale (for $25K) quite some time ago. It is an early Hawk Cars HF3000QV and has a Ferrari 308 V8 engine (which explains why it needs the NACA ducts on the sides for extra cooling). As I remember, the bodywork was nice enough but it had a home-made dash that looked pretty bad (as in not at all like a real Stratos). I can post some other pictures of it if anyone is interested.
If you're ever wondering if a Stratos is real or not, one of the easy kit give-aways is 4 bolt hubs. Many of the newer kits have the proper 5 bolt hubs though so this only works for older ones. If you can look at the engine, all the real cars used the Ferrari Dino 246 V6. Very few kits have this engine as it is so expensive ($20K+). The real test though is to knock on the roof. All the real cars had a steel monocoque but the kits, no matter how well prepared, will always be fiberglass.
PS - Hope I don't sound like I'm taking the fun out of seeing the car or anything - It's always fun to see a neat & unusual car. I just don't like the idea of him trying to sell it as a real one. It makes for bad feelings between us kit owners and the people with the real ones.
>Sorry Jon, It's a very neat find, but it's a Kit.
Thanks for the information. When I saw the post, I was rather dubious about the car since it appeared to be in excellent condition and was only worth $50k.
If I owned a real Stratos, I certainly would not have those junky stickers on it and there is no way it would be on a trailer - it would be driven!
I like your steel roof test method. In a related story, at the 1973 World Championship Rally of the Rideau Lakes, when Lancia brought Munari's Stratos to scrutineering, everything was in order until we noticed that the car had no roll cage at all! When asked about it, Mike Parkes pulled out the homologation papers - the Stratos was homologated with the roll cage built into the body of the car. Upon closer inspection, it was very easy to see the cage installation. Perhaps this would be another way to separate the pretenders from the real thing.
BTW, are there any real Stratos cars in North America? Are any of them ex-works rally cars?
Thanks for the story - I'll bet it was interesting to see peoples reactions to the car. I have not heard very many first hand stories about racing them so any tidbits are most appreciated.
Checking the cage is a good idea as that's another thing all the replicas will have. Unfortunatly the cage doesn't meet SCCA specs. so we're having to replace/upgrade ours.
There are several real Stratos's in the US and few replicas too. I know of at least 5 real ones and have heard rumors of a few more. There is at least one for sale but I'm not sure how good the price is. You have to be careful because even with the real ones, you are often getting a car that has been built from one or more wrecked or otherwise irrepairable cars. It's hard to know what makes a good buy instead of a money pit. The cheapest examples seem to go for about $80K but they are often in foreign countries.
I know of 4 finished replicas and 2 that are in progress in the US. The general consensus is that building a good replica will cost around $35K but it can be as low as $25K if you are patient and willing to live without a 24V engine.
Please let me know if you want any more info on any of this - it's always nice to be able to put an obsession to good use. ;-)
PS - As an interesting bit of trivia, there is one replica car started (I believe it was never finished) that had a steel monocoque built to the original specification by Lotus. I know it cost a LOT of $$$ and suspect it influenced the creation of the M250 (I think that's the right model number).
I found the original web page listing the car for sale. Sorry - I seem to have got the price wrong. I know I saw one for that price somewhere - now I'll be trying to remember where all day. Anyway, here's the link.
Yeah, I saw it at import Carlisle '01, and he told me it was a genuine one as well. Gave me some BS about why the serial numbers are Fiat, as he had to fool the DMV or some such thing. He also tole me that the Dino motor had been blown, and thats why it had the 308.
I didn't think it looked like a real one up close, and I've had others more knowledgable than I confirm that it isn't. He didn't have all the stickers on it last year though. I still wouldn't mind having it.
And Jon, why didn't you stop by and say hi? I was only selling stuff in spaces J-88 thru J-90 all weekend... I even had a booth set up for RallySport...
'71 Volvo 142E (daily driver/RallyCross)
Editor, Blue Mountain Region, SCCA www.bmr-scca.org
Yeah - this kind of thing really pisses off everybody in the Stratos Replica Club. We generally have a good relationship with the people who own & support the real ones but this kind of thing really hurts that. It's hard enough finding parts whithout having to convince the seller that you're not going to con somebody into buying your replica as a real car. Hopefully my replica will look a lot more authentic than the yellow car when it's done, but I'll still make sure everybody knows it's not original. I would love to take mine to Carlisle in a year or two and put the this guy in his place. Maybe I could make some big signs that told people how to tell a real car from a replica. }>
- They did have at least one - running in European Rally Cross series in late '70s/early '80s. Same year as Volvo got involved with a Renault Turbo powered 343.
- I saw the car in Finland and Sweden, and it had a Ferrari V8 (308GTS?), and it went like poisoned rat.....till it broke down (happened quite often)
- I see if I can locate some pics & info. I took some pics when they changed; headers, tranny, one head, axels, etc !! Those Italians worked so hard to get car back running...
- You can do the same, look for European Rallycross sites
PS. Ferrari V6s are not that expensive; You can still find Fiat Dino Coupes in California for $ 10-15 000 (Same V6 engine as Stratos).