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I know that a US competitor can compete in CARS events with a SCCA license but what about a NASA license? If a NASA license was acceptable how would you determine if you were elegible for the national events versus the regional? Thoughts.

Gary
 

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Faster Mabricator
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NASA licenses are not accepted by CARS.

"At this time, the CARS Board will not recognize or accept NASA
licences for entry into CARS events. Neither CARS nor ASN Canada
FIA have received any correspondence from NASA in regard to
establishing official recognition."
 

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If you have any intentions of running multiple CARS events, why not get a CARS license? The cost of a CARS license is a bargain in US $$. Your car may have to be altered to conform and or fit into a Canadian class before getting it's logbook, but this is generally not a huge deal as long as you have a proper roll cage. Once your car has a CARS logbook, you can rally it anywhere.
This is just my opinion...
 

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Flat over crest
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How would you recommend someone living in say, the Detroit (Windsor/Sarnia) area, go about getting a CARS logbook?

Let's assume this US citizen also needs to become a member of one of the Canadian clubs. Is one better than another in this area?

What else might this interested individual find useful to know about running in Canada?

Scott
www.teamharco.com
Team Harco Motorsports
"Win on Sunday, Sleep on Monday"
 

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Dramamine is for DramaQueens
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If your car is currently scca logbooked, you woudl not be able to (or need to) get a cars logbook. However, if you wanted to run in canadian events and score points in the championships, then you would need a CARS license, and that would mean joining a Canadian Club, I'd suggest the closest to Detroit so that you can occasionally contribute to the club.

NOW for the tricky part. If you run the car with an scca license then it can conform to scca rules, if you run under a CARS license it must be upgraded to CARS rules. If the car is built already there is a more than reasonable chance this would mean re-caging the car.
 

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Flat over crest
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>If your car is currently scca logbooked, you woudl not be
>able to (or need to) get a cars logbook. However, if you
>wanted to run in canadian events and score points in the
>championships, then you would need a CARS license, and that
>would mean joining a Canadian Club, I'd suggest the closest
>to Detroit so that you can occasionally contribute to the
>club.
>
>NOW for the tricky part. If you run the car with an scca
>license then it can conform to scca rules, if you run under
>a CARS license it must be upgraded to CARS rules. If the car
>is built already there is a more than reasonable chance this
>would mean re-caging the car.
Keith,

Thanks for the feedback. Let's take this slow (I'm a US citizen afterall).

1) I want to stop giving money away to SCCA.
2) I want to see if there are means to this end, within reason, by commiting to CARS. (I still hope to run Sno*Drift each year - so maybe none of this makes sense).
3) The cage was updated to meet the new SCCA standards. I have been going over the CARS rule book and I believe I am incompliance with their standards. Are there some specific areas that SCCA cages tend to come up short with respect to CARS rules?
4) Directed at anyone near Windsor/Sarnia - who can I talk to for more info?
5) We are planning to run Tall Pines - so I expect we can get a good looking over there to see what, if anything, will need to be changed to come in-line with CARS regulations.

Thank you for your time and patience, 'eh.

Scott
www.teamharco.com
Team Harco Motorsports
"Win on Sunday, Sleep on Monday"
 

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Dramamine is for DramaQueens
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>Thanks for the feedback. Let's take this slow (I'm a US
>citizen afterall).

>3) The cage was updated to meet the new SCCA standards. I
>have been going over the CARS rule book and I believe I am
>incompliance with their standards. Are there some specific
>areas that SCCA cages tend to come up short with respect to
>CARS rules?

Yes, Tubing sizes and wall thickness
I know of at least 2 cars that had to completely be recaged after being brought into Canada and at least two more that should have been re-caged. If your car was logbooked before 2000 it may not be an issue. You should be able to get the answers you are looking for at Tall Pines.
 

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Scott,

I believe the HUGE cage point is the diameter of the main roll hoop in the cage.

There is a year maybe 2002, when the CARS rules began requiring 1.75" diameter tubing....while SCCA still lists 1.50".

If your logbook was issued before this "new rule" date, I'm not sure if you're grandfathered or not....or how that works.

I'd call the CARS National Office.

Brian
 

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Need ride. Please send money.
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We too are very close to having our WRX "ready enough for a shakedown rally" by Nov 1, so we are considering Tall Pines (Jeffy bending my ear HAS had an effect). :)

I have an FIA cage, so I assume that is CARS acceptable?

Does CARS have an online rulebook?

Although, we *may* do it OLD school with no odo, just for the pure fun of it. (and cuz I dont have money for a new Alfa yet).

ANybody wanna lend me some used gravels?

hehehe

**EDIT- How cold does it get up there in Nov? I suppose sleeping in the Suburban is out of the question, huh? ANybody got floor space for some po US rally freaks?

JC
#595
www.gnimotorsports.com
 

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Canadian Rally Clubs ... from the CARS website
http://www.carsrally.ca/Clubs.html

I would suggest either Kitchener/Waterloo or the Maple Leaf Rally Club would be the closest.

Definitely while at Pines talk to Terry Epp, Ross Wood or any of the other Toronto area folks.

Then come play in our snow ... errr roads.

Shawn
 

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Flat over crest
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No problem on the cage. It's all 1.75" x 0.095"

I hope your snow is as slippery as ours! Do the roads tend to get icy as well? I'd prefer to use my Hakkas over any other tire (if conditions are right).

JC - yes, the CARS rules are online. Go here then to documents: http://www.carsrally.ca/

Scott
www.teamharco.com
Team Harco Motorsports
"Win on Sunday, Sleep on Monday"
 

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1973 WRC POR
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RE: Tall Pines Roads/Tires

>I hope your snow is as slippery as ours! Do the roads tend
>to get icy as well? I'd prefer to use my Hakkas over any
>other tire (if conditions are right).

Scott:

As the rally approaches, the Tall Pines organizers usually post road conditions and pictures on the rally website.

Tires required will depend on the weather conditions which can literally be anything. You should have tires for gravel, mud, snow and ice, or you may get caught out.

Doug Woods
 

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straight at T
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2,472 Posts
>No problem on the cage. It's all 1.75" x 0.095"

Depends on the actual material - if it doesn't match the requirements in NRR II C 2 d) then it has to be 1.75 x 0.120. The CARS car prep rules are on-line at www.carsrally.ca

FIA cages are legal.

>I hope your snow is as slippery as ours! Do the roads tend
>to get icy as well? I'd prefer to use my Hakkas over any
>other tire (if conditions are right).

Tall Pines is more like LSPR than Sno*Drift. It can be dry, but if not it can be snowy, icy, rutted, mucky, ... Typically (and especially in recent years) the temperature doesn't go much below freezing and can easily be in the 40s during the day.

I'll be at LSPR if you want to chat there.

Adrian
 

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Flat over crest
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RE: Tall Pines Roads/Tires

>>I hope your snow is as slippery as ours! Do the roads tend
>Scott:
>
>As the rally approaches, the Tall Pines organizers usually
>post road conditions and pictures on the rally website.
>
>Tires required will depend on the weather conditions which
>can literally be anything. You should have tires for
>gravel, mud, snow and ice, or you may get caught out.
>
>Doug Woods

Doug,

We'll bring every tire we can carry. I'm just a little concerned about that in-between condition. Too cold for a gravel tire, but too grippy for a snow tire. We don't have much that works well there.

Scott
www.teamharco.com
Team Harco Motorsports
"Win on Sunday, Sleep on Monday"
 

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Flat over crest
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303 Posts
>>No problem on the cage. It's all 1.75" x 0.095"
>
>Depends on the actual material - if it doesn't match the
>requirements in NRR II C 2 d) then it has to be 1.75 x
>0.120. The CARS car prep rules are on-line at
>www.carsrally.ca

>FIA cages are legal.
>
>>I hope your snow is as slippery as ours! Do the roads tend
>>to get icy as well? I'd prefer to use my Hakkas over any
>>other tire (if conditions are right).
>
>Tall Pines is more like LSPR than Sno*Drift. It can be dry,
>but if not it can be snowy, icy, rutted, mucky, ...
>Typically (and especially in recent years) the temperature
>doesn't go much below freezing and can easily be in the 40s
>during the day.
>
>I'll be at LSPR if you want to chat there.
>
>Adrian

It's DOM, so it seems to match the requirement.

Nope - won't be at LSPR. It breaks my heart to miss it. The entry fees have just gone above our threshold for reality. We will be spending our (performance) rally dollars in Canada for awhile. Hope you don't mind.

Scott
www.teamharco.com
Team Harco Motorsports
"Win on Sunday, Sleep on Monday"
 

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1973 WRC POR
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2,421 Posts
>We will be spending our (performance) rally
>dollars in Canada for awhile. Hope you don't mind.

Scott:

Will you be buying our beer also?

Is Kent co-driving for you at Pines?

Doug Woods
 

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Flat over crest
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>>We will be spending our (performance) rally
>>dollars in Canada for awhile. Hope you don't mind.
>
>Scott:
>
>Will you be buying our beer also?
>
>Is Kent co-driving for you at Pines?
>
>Doug Woods

Yes!! I'll be buying Canadian beer. Not sure I can afford to buy YOUR beer. I'd be honored to drink with you all though.

Yes. Kent is making plans to participate as well.

Scott
www.teamharco.com
Team Harco Motorsports
"Win on Sunday, Sleep on Monday"
 

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1973 WRC POR
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2,421 Posts
>>Is Kent co-driving for you at Pines?

>Yes. Kent is making plans to participate as well.

Scott:

Great. I look forward to meeting you and seeing Kent again (I think it has been about 30 years!).

I will see you sometime before the rally. You don't want to have to see me during the rally, as I will be a Steward. ;)

Doug Woods
 

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just another old phart
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A meeting with Doug Woods and real Canadian beer. Kewl. Looking forward to it! Doug, I'll be the one wearing the Tall Pines 1974 competitors badge that I found the other day while cleaning out my sock drawer.

Adrian or Dave G, our team hasn't suffered from any road minutes penalties yet on SCCA events but I know the procedures are slightly different on CARS events. When you have a chance, can you point out the differences that I need to be aware of?

Kent Gardam
 

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straight at T
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The CARS timing system is a modified FIA system. You are given a bogey time for the stage and a transit time. If all goes well, and you are faster than the bogey time, you add the bogey time and the transit time to your START time to determine your arrival time at the next control. If you exceed the bogey time, you calculate your arrival time as you would in an SCCA event, by adding the transit time to your FINISH time (dropping the seconds). The logic is that you get the benefits of the FIA system while ensuring that you always have sufficient time to drive the transits.

Adrian
 
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