Special Stage Forums banner

1 - 16 of 16 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
113 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
From the Radio New Zealand site:


The man who caused the death of rally driver Possum Bourne has been sentenced to 300 hours community work.


Michael Barltrop has also been disqualified from driving for 18 months, and ordered to pay $10,000 in reparations.


Half that will go to the Possum Bourne Education Trust, and the rest to the Dunedin Hospital intensive care unit.


The vehicle Barltrop was driving collided with Possum Bourne's car while they conducted reconnaissance for last year's Race To The Sky hill climb at Cardrona, near Wanaka.


Barltrop last month pleaded guilty to aggravated careless use of a vehicle causing death.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
113 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Well lets see...........................In the good old US of A you can become a millionaire if ya spill McDonalds coffee on yerself, if an employer doesn't employ you because you're the wrong colour or religion. If the doc leaves a chainsaw in ya after an operation etc. etc. etc.

We are talking negligence here. Not only were three kids robbed of a father, a wife of a husband, a mother of a son and countless life long friends lost a buddy. The rally community worldwide lost a damn fine bloke. you know what "community service" is here?????? Stacking library books, weeding a garden for a retiree, hell even manning a marshalls post at your favorite sport of rallying can be regarded as community service. You know how far $5,ooo goes in an education trust for three kids or in an intensive care unit (two plasters and a light bulb).

The guy got a slap over the back of a hand with a feather. Sit back John and think, if your life was taken needlessly, do you think it is worth more than that???? Going by your comments, at the moment I don't think you would be worth half of one percent of what Possum was worth to the rally world let alone his family. I know the world is all the more the poorer for not having a character like Possum around. I have a feeling the world wouldn't give a sheet of toilet paper if you were gone tomorrow but if we don't have accountability why bother paying legislators and beauracrats if we put such a tiny value on human life.

By the way, ya didn't wind me up. I'd expect such a response from you, it is true what everyone says about you. Thanks for the confirmation.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
789 Posts
Rover--That was the criminal disposition of the matter.

In our country, the surviving family members commence civil actions to recover monetary damages, assuming the defendant(s) has assets or insurance.

I suspect that there may be some tort liability similarity in NZ, but then again, maybe not.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
768 Posts
RE: Kiwi Justice

It was an ACCIDENT. I take Kiwi justice over an American anyday...
- Both cars were driving too fast
- Both were middle of the road
- Both were part of hi-risk racing event, knowingly and willingly
- Get over with it
 

·
400 flat to crest
Joined
·
5,777 Posts
In the last year Whatever your name is, I have lost a friend I loved dearly and on brave woman who asked to build her own motor 15 years ago, Ann Monis and my father, both dead from cancer.
Ann about 10 months ago, my father about 3 months ago.

So you see the whole inarguable finality of death has been right there in the forefront of my conciousness lately.

_I_ have no idea what is appropriate in an accident like this.

But YOU seemed to have some idea as you expressed what seems exasperation or disgust in the words "a slap on the wrist".

It was a simple question.

What may be true from everybody YOU speak with may not be the only truth.
YOU have jumped to a conclusion.

Again it was a simple question and I'll pose it again since you were so busy pontidficicating with your " I have a feeling the world wouldn't give a sheet of toilet paper if you were gone tomorrow."



I mean, whatever the hell your name is, all that writing and you couldn't spare a couple of words to answer
WHAT WOULD YOU RECCOMEND THE PENALTY BE?

And I did talk to Possum one time, seemes like a really friendly and humourous guy, he turned me over to one of his tech guys who was also very helpful no BS guy.




John Vanlandingham
Seattle, WA. 98168

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat!
Vive Le Groupe F!
 

·
400 flat to crest
Joined
·
5,777 Posts
>Spending a year with you with no other outside contact.

So why don't YOU actually answer the question Mr Know-it-all?
What would be a proper solution?

Read Topi's comments.
And try to be more positive.

(You don't understand positive. You can't handle positive!)




John Vanlandingham
Seattle, WA. 98168

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat!
Vive Le Groupe F!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
113 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
RE: Kiwi Justice

Here are the reasons for my frustrations and why I consider he got a slap over the wrist. Several of the reasons are spelled out in my original post.

New Zealand has a system called "Accident Compensation" Everyone pays into it through tax, vehicle registration, employer contribution, sports fees etc. etc. In the even of an accident whether it is work, home or play - an individual is covered for all costs. If the accident results in permanent injury, all living and medical costs are covered for life. If death occurs, the funeral costs are covered.

There is no compensation for relatives, costs are limited to the person. There is no right to sue, we have no civil proceedings to follow. Accident Compensation was introduced to avoid a system where everyone sues everyone for everything. It guarantees you will not be out of pocket as a result of an accident but like I said, it doesn't extend to the family.

Now onto the "accident" Baltrop pleaded not guilty at every hearing for over a year, even went on record in the media saying Possum was on the wrong side of the road. Our eqivilent of CSI went to the hearing last month and proved the following:

- Baltrop was on the wrong side of the road on a blind corner.
He was aware there would be oncoming traffic!! He was showing
his co-driver the line he wanted to take in the race.
- His speed exiting the corner was over 80kph, his speed at the
point of impact was 68kph.
- He should have seen Possum as his vehicle, a Jeep Cherokee went
over a blind brow but braking indicated he only applied them
100 feet from impact.
- Possum was doing 60kph approaching the scene, he applied brakes,
moved as far left (the correct side in NZ) as possible and his
at impact was 28kph.
- Although the speed at impact was less than 50mph (not overly fast
by some standards, the Jeep rode up over the Legacy crushing
Possum's head.
- Since the incident, Baltrop, a rich little boy living on daddy's
money and defended by daddy's expensive lawyers, has been
convicted of two other speeding offences on public roads.

That's why I'm so annoyed.It wasn't an accident!!! Baltrop was the "accident" waiting to happen with his total neglect in a sport that demands certain standards. He was a newbie ralliast. Until the facts emerged in court he had refused to take any blame for it, even accusing Possum in the media of being the one at fault.

Now the sentence......$10,000 fine (it'll be paid for by Daddy so wont worry Baltrop too much) and "Community Service". Well, being a marshall at a rally is regared as community service. Skiing around a mountain (Baltrop's other passion) looking for avalanche hazzards is Community Service. You honestly think that's a punishment??? Heck, he can even claim the cost of wet weather or snow gear to do that community service!!!!


I'm over Possum's death as are most people, we aren't calling for blood, but hey, friends spent $100,000 for a statue of Possum which stands on the Mountain near the "Race to the Sky" road. Friends knew his worth to society, the justice system didn't. It appears his widow Peggy is too. She is dating another sportsman and is in just about every womens magazine and Sunday Gossip coloumn on a regular basis. I just think it's a shame that a guy who gave so much to so many is worth so little in the way of a punishment but that's our legal system.

An appropriate punishment???? Certainly confinement, for no other reason than to put him in a solitary situation where he can reflect on the effects of his actions, as he was in denial so long. A far bigger fine, to cover a lot more of the costs associated with the case. Why should tax payers have to carry the burden of his actions. Community Service?? How about going into high schools where kids are readying to get their licences and tell them what a bit of neglect can do and the effects such neglect can have.

Maybe you guys just needed to know a little more about the situation before making your assumptions!!!

Cheers,

Don
 

·
400 flat to crest
Joined
·
5,777 Posts
RE: Kiwi Justice

That was certainly a reasonable answer.

Too bad you make such arrogant assumptions about others when they ask a simple question, though.






John Vanlandingham
Seattle, WA. 98168

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat!
Vive Le Groupe F!
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
2,738 Posts
<<< By the way, ya didn't wind me up. I'd expect such a response from you, it is true what everyone says about you. Thanks for the confirmation.>>>


Don, your comments say it all.


To JVL, just what have the deaths you mentioned, sad as they are, have ANYTHING to do with a traffic accident that was being discussed?

By the way, Baltrop should have done some serious jail time.

Lastly to Topi, always mouthing off about how bad this country is, you STILL here?



Can't see me in your mirrors?
I must be in front of you!
 

·
400 flat to crest
Joined
·
5,777 Posts
You dolt, I said with these I have been thinking a lot about the whole finality of death thing, but you're so senile you didn't see that

He it is again since you're too blind or too drunk or whatever you problem is that its impossible to see it the first time:
>>>So you see the whole inarguable finality of death has been right there in the forefront of my conciousness lately.<<<<<<

And just 8 days ago one the nice guys I rent a house to just had a call that his Mom was killed pulling out of a parking spot, t boned by a kid in a SUV.
Just ___THINKING____ about how suddenly and final it can come, or slow but cetainly FINAL.



John Vanlandingham
Seattle, WA. 98168

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat!
Vive Le Groupe F!
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
2,738 Posts
<<<< Whatever your name is, >>>>

I stand by what I said in my previous post. We all deal with death, what makes you so special that you have to be singled out for "special treatment". Maybe you're not grown up enough! Maybe you were too blinded by your anger for some reason or other, who really cares, but Don did sign off with his posts. If he didn't, all you had to do was click on the profile and you would have found it for yourself.

You really are an obnoxious, ignorant a$$hole!


Can't see me in your mirrors?
I must be in front of you!
 

·
400 flat to crest
Joined
·
5,777 Posts
It was explained clearly enough, and it was unimportant, it was called a "preface' to a comment, but since you read at about 8 year old level, you don't understand what a simple comment explaining what may have promted a though since you vomit up your thought unmitigated and undigested if not out one end then out the other.

What does your abrasive braying have to do with this either?

The main thing is "Don" did add some details I had not previously seen and it seems the guy is a typical rich punk POS like we have plenty of here in the US.
I can think of one recent drop in and drop out of the sport who before he was 21 had put 2 people into hospital crashing cars on the streets around Boston, and it seems there is different justice for the priveleged in NZ jst like there is here.

Still, nothing can change what happened, so move on, and by the way Pete: Shut the **** up if you don't understand things.





John Vanlandingham
Seattle, WA. 98168

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat!
Vive Le Groupe F!
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
2,738 Posts
<<<< Shut the **** up if you don't understand things. >>>>

Why? Just to make your miserable life bearable again. No way!

By the way, is there a time that you can make a comment without having to resort to using abusive language? That's a sure sign that you are losing!

I responded because of your un-civil response which was totally uncalled for.

An apology to Don would be in order too.





Can't see me in your mirrors?
I must be in front of you!
 
1 - 16 of 16 Posts
Top