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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Why do none of the US Rally championships have a cheap one make championship? Its pretty simple - Get ahold of a car manufacture that makes a cheap small car ...example Chevy Aveo. The car fully preped would be around 10-12k = make a deal where you can finace it threw dealerships. The cars will all be equal so the best driver will win not the machine... Make the manufacture set a good purse for the championship so people have motivation to buy the cars in the first place. It will be a win/win situation---

Manufacture -
1. Have probally 15-20 of their cars running the championship
2. They make money off the cars they sell plus its a cheap investment

Rally Championship
1. Brand spanking new shiny cars running in their championship
2. More competitors and a way to motivate newbies into the sport

I know I would do it in a heartbeat ....
 

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Well, you have several big assumptions there...

1. That newbies would be willing to drop 10-12k on their first rally car.
Right now I think you'll find most are aiming for 6k or less.

2. That a significant number of competitors would actually want to run the chosen make & model.
Have you seen the diversity of cars out there? The diversity of opinions on here? Good luck getting agreement on any one car.

3. That a manufacturer could be convinced to provide said cars and nationwide sponsorship.
Rally isn't exactly a high-profile motorsport in this country and having two national championships probably isn't going to score points with a prospective manufacturer/sponsor.

Identical equipment best team wins is a fine ideal, it may not make such a cosy reality.

Ian.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
>Well, you have several big assumptions there...
>
>1. That newbies would be willing to drop 10-12k on their first
>rally car.
>Right now I think you'll find most are aiming for 6k or less.
>
>2. That a significant number of competitors would actually
>want to run the chosen make & model.
>Have you seen the diversity of cars out there? The diversity
>of opinions on here? Good luck getting agreement on any one
>car.
>
>3. That a manufacturer could be convinced to provide said cars
>and nationwide sponsorship.
>Rally isn't exactly a high-profile motorsport in this country
>and having two national championships probably isn't going to
>score points with a prospective manufacturer/sponsor.
>
>Identical equipment best team wins is a fine ideal, it may not
>make such a cosy reality.
>
>Ian.

Manufactures only care about exposure to dollar ratio. They are breaking even, it would be very cost effective marketing. My friend ran in the ford ka championship a couple years ago and he loved it. They had a large amount of entries and the cars cost double the price of a preped Aveo.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
>"The car fully preped would be around 10-12k"
>Change that to: parts to prep car (minus labor) would cost
>10-12k.
>rz

Invoice on a Aveo is around 6k ... Having the car use stock parts would be key to keep the price down "brakes/tranny/motor/" Having a kit where you can build it yourself would be key so your not forced to pay shop prices.. unless you want too..Hell everyting on my rally car is stock except for the exhaust and suspension.... and it works just fine
 

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>>"The car fully preped would be around 10-12k"
>>Change that to: parts to prep car (minus labor) would cost
>>10-12k.
>>rz
>
>Invoice on a Aveo is around 6k ... Having the car use stock
>parts would be key to keep the price down
>"brakes/tranny/motor/" Having a kit where you can build it
>yourself would be key so your not forced to pay shop prices..
>unless you want too..Hell everyting on my rally car is stock
>except for the exhaust and suspension.... and it works just
>fine

Randy is right.

Kalos (Aveo) Challenge cars in the Benelux countries cost 25K Euros fully prepped. Of course, they come with goodies like ProFlex suspension.
 

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No sense in doing any sort of one make series without spending the money to prep the car correctly. With everone running the same equipment, it always comes down to commitment and talent. Drivers will push harder to get the extra second or two and proper prep will save money in the long run. Build them right and they will come!
 

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400 flat to crest
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>>"The car fully preped would be around 10-12k"
>>Change that to: parts to prep car (minus labor) would cost
>>10-12k.
>>rz
>
>Invoice on a Aveo is around 6k ... Having the car use stock
>parts would be key to keep the price down
>"brakes/tranny/motor/" Having a kit where you can build it
>yourself would be key so your not forced to pay shop prices..
>unless you want too..Hell everyting on my rally car is stock
>except for the exhaust and suspension.... and it works just
>fine
The really long lasting and successful single make series in the UK and France both have cars with good performance, hot motors, short gearing , limited slip diffs, all provided by far sighted companies with other rally involvement who know that in a single make series, doesn't matter which DRIVER wins, they can write a press release the Citroen or Peugoet or Skoda wins.

Seeing how the average US turbo 4wd competitor drives less spactularly than the average 1600 B licence National driver in at least Western Europe, by MY OWN OBSERVATION, the sight of a bunch of cheap, STOCK econoboxes driven by Novices fills me with visions of whichever car manufacturer who was lied to enough to believe it would be good press laying dead from heartpailure if he ever SAW the cars.

One thing that they do to ENTICE people to build and enter is have good and DEEP prize funds, $4000 to 10,000 in some of the single make things in France payed out PER EVENT.

So:
A:Alert MFG
B: comprehensive high performance kit
C: big and deep payoff per event.

Good theory
Bad Reality.








John Vanlandingham
Seattle, WA. 98168

janvanvurpa (at) f4 (dot) ca

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat!
Vive Le Groupe F!
 

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Invoice on an Aveo $6000 ????

Yah and I have a Wooly Mammoth for a pet and live in Xanadu.

Get a grip don't make me post the real invoice.

Cheers
M.Samli
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
>Invoice on an Aveo $6000 ????
>
>Yah and I have a Wooly Mammoth for a pet and live in Xanadu.
>
>Get a grip don't make me post the real invoice.
>
>Cheers
>M.Samli
>

Whats the name of your Mammoth? MSRP for a Aveo is 9,995 ... The real invoice is around 6k+or- My job that helped me pay for rally was keeping track of invoices for dealerships.

The whole point of this post was to discuss why we dont have a one make series .. not to nitpick my imaginary Chevy Aveo example
 

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>>Invoice on an Aveo $6000 ????
>>
>>Yah and I have a Wooly Mammoth for a pet and live in Xanadu.
>>
>>Get a grip don't make me post the real invoice.
>>
>>Cheers
>>M.Samli
>>
>
>Whats the name of your Mammoth? MSRP for a Aveo is 9,995 ...
>The real invoice is around 6k+or- My job that helped me pay
>for rally was keeping track of invoices for dealerships.
>
>The whole point of this post was to discuss why we dont have a
>one make series .. not to nitpick my imaginary Chevy Aveo
>example
Well hate to say it but since you indentified it I will.
The whole idea is.....
>given the whole history of rally in the USA,

>our big fixation with wanting to claim to be unique or individuals (Brian: You're all unique indivuiduals!!!!"" Gathered multitudes in unison "Yes! We are all unique individuals!"),

>the compulsive need to claim to be "winner"s (wieners?)as evidenced in the plethora of classes in most amature racing,

>ALL the reasons listed before

The whole idea is IMAGINARY in the extreme.





John Vanlandingham
Seattle, WA. 98168

janvanvurpa (at) f4 (dot) ca

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat!
Vive Le Groupe F!
 

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>
> MSRP for a Aveo is 9,995 ...
>The real invoice is around 6k+or- My job that helped me pay
>for rally was keeping track of invoices for dealerships.
>
>The whole point of this post was to discuss why we dont have a
>one make series .. not to nitpick my imaginary Chevy Aveo
>example

I think the cars would never sell for anywhere near to dealer invoice. What would happen would be that every Joe would say "Oh yeah, I am going to race in the Texrex Rally Challenge series..." just to get a cheap car. The manufacturers and dealers know this and woudl noever do it; hence, the Neon ACR was not sold for any sort of cheap price. So start with a $9k price very stipped down, put in the new cage and safety stuff and some decent shocks, and you're up to $15-18k, bare bones. Now, you get to be competitive, and rip it down for full prep and all the tricks you can, now the $25k Euros starts to be the winning car price.

Would I pay this kind of money for a small rally car? No. Is this a bad idea? Heck no, so don't be picking too hard on Texrex. It's been kicked around many times here by many others, so his idea should not be derided. But this has not gone anywhere in the past.

Mark B.
 

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e
>The really long lasting and successful single make series in
>the UK and France both have cars with good performance, hot
>motors, short gearing , limited slip diffs, all provided by
>far sighted companies with other rally involvement who know
>that in a single make series, doesn't matter which DRIVER
>wins, they can write a press release the Citroen or Peugoet or
>Skoda wins.

>
>One thing that they do to ENTICE people to build and enter is
>have good and DEEP prize funds, $4000 to 10,000 in some of the
>single make things in France payed out PER EVENT.
>
>Good theory
>Bad Reality.
>

JVL is right on with these points. That's what makes a good series. Don't think that the sanctioning bodies aren't all over the manufacturers for a one make series, cuz they are. But so far no one has been able to line one up that was any kind of a deal for the competitors (ie. they addressed the points John brought up above). Having a series just for the sake of having it won't do anybody any good. It needs to be right, and so far no one wants to invest in a proper series.


Dennis Martin
[email protected]
920-432-4845
 

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Dear TexRex

You can not start an intelligent argument or conversation with incorrect data in your hand and regardles of your summer-job's relation with dealers you are sadly mistaken about the invoice price of an Aveo. Invoice on a base Aveo 5sp no a/c is actually $9643 including $540 destination charge. MSRP of the same unit is $9995.

If I can find a scanner I'll post it right here.

You may find $352 a very low profit margin but it is what it is and there is a reason behind it.

Cheers
M.Samli
 
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