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You are able to apply more force with less effort.

Many decades ago, automobiles used "mechanical" brakes which were akin to the modern cable e-brake or hand brake. Going to hydraulics became the standard because you could actually stop from higher speeds in shorter distances without being Arnold Schwarzenegger.

Try it...You'll like it!
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
HaHa Funny you mentioned that Garrett. I was thinking something similar execpt use a switch on the throtle pedal. This way if your still on the gas you can left foot brake which will only affect the rear brakes because of the line lock activated by the throtle pedal switch. This will bring the rear out more easily and be less wear on the front pads/rotors.
 

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When you get rid of the little worthless stock calipers on the rear you also get rid of all the odd cable activated stuff to make the hand brake work on disk brakes. Real competition calipers do not have any of the engineering clung necessary to activate them by cable so now what are you going to do?

You go to a hydraulic hand brake in series with the normal brake line to the rear brakes.

It is amasing what car manufactures have done to make the cable hand brake work on disk brakes. Subrats sometimes have a little drum brake inside of the normal disk for the hand brake. Some cars have pistons the thread out and have to be turned back in when adding new pads...

Derek
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I just asumed that there was a slave cylinder like a clutch pulling on the stock cables.

The hydraulic hand brake working directly to the calipers hydraulically is a way better ideal. I was planning on rebuilding the calipers on my Talon simple because the park brake screw in the calipers are getting sticky.

One question though when you say the hydraulic hand brake works in series with the normal brake line to the rear brakes, how is the pressure stopped from going back up to the master cylinder?

Anyone have a schematic they can post?
 

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You use what is (or is essentially) a master cylinder for the handbrake cylinder. All master cylinders have a check valve in the inlet to stop the piston from pushing the fluid back up into the reservoir, instead of down to the calipers or cylinders.

The same thing happens here. Plumb the master cylinder rear outlet line into the inlet of the handbrake cylinder; the check valve in the handbrake cylinder prevents the problem you bring up. The output of the handbrake cylinder goes to the rear calipers. Either the fluid from the master cylinder, flowing through the handbrake cylinder, or the handbrake cylinder itself, will activate the rear brakes.

The control and reduced effort versus a cable system is terrific. You will be happy. :)

Mark Bowers
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I maybe wrong but I'm pretty sure there isn't a check valve in or at the master cylinder. I don't know about your car but any car I have ever changed brake pads on when I push the caliper piston in fluid goes back up through the master to the reservoir. Also if there where check valves at the master the brakes wouldn't release after you push the brake pedal because the fluid would have no place to go.
 

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Don't get all hung up on descriptions, take a look at the nice drawing under 'Hey John V Help' by Rally 900.
Very nice drawing, and a faily detailed description of the install process, it's old stuff, been done for 30 years, just do it.

I have the brackets to do this and you can call 206 431 9696, they are copies in materials and design of Ford Motorsport's 1990 spec stuff.
Nice stuff, tig welded.
You can buy anybodies 5/8" brake master if you want.

What car and caliper are you thinking about?













John Vanlandingham
 

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I see your point and wondered about the same thing for years. Some MC's do have check valves in the reservoir which activate from positive pressure from the MC piston side, not the caliper side; others prevent backflow into the reservoir when the piston moves so far as to cover the inlet hole so it can't back flow. Good point; sorry if I did a bad job of explaining.

Mark
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Here is a schematic of the [link:photos.yahoo.com/bc/darrylmalone/vwp?.dir=/jokes&.src=ph&.dnm=brake.jpg&.view=t&.done=http%3a//photos.yahoo.com/bc/darrylmalone/lst%3f%26.dir=/jokes%26.src=ph%26.view=t|brake] system that I came up with.
Is this correct?
 

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Nope thats not right. There is no "T" from the handbrake to the line, the handbrake master cylinder is inline. The inlet that was for the hose to the resevoir for your handbrake is now threaded and is the "in" line from your main master cylinder. The line that would go straight to the rear brakes now goes in and out of the handbrake master cylinder and then to the rear wheels.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Actually that makes a little more sense and kind of answers my previous question. Is this correct. [link:photos.yahoo.com/bc/darrylmalone/vwp?.dir=/jokes&.dnm=brake2.jpg&.src=ph&.view=t&.hires=t|brake2]
 

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>Actually that makes a little more sense and kind of answers
>my previous question. Is this correct.

Yes, and look hard at the drawing about the placement of the bolt or pin which on the last one I did, Derek 'Uncorked' Bottles FORMER Maz-dog GTX I drilled straight thru the handbrake lever and ran a bolt thru, ran a nut down to lock it and had the master braket a bit off center.
Need more info?]
















John Vanlandingham
 

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RE: Hydraulic hand brake or extra rear only pedal?

>What about a line lock on the rears :) Have a push button on
>the wheel or something. That sounds dangerous :)

In one of the most ignored in the US but really cool cars all the same, the OPEL KADETT E GSi 16v was homologated under GpA rules with a 'SECOND Brake pedal left side in the pedal area, sec 803'.
it worked the rear brakes only and was done to help 'the old boys' transition from Asconas and Manta rwd to fwd.

















John Vanlandingham
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Do people who use a hydraulic hand brake keep the stock cable brake in place?
I would think that just a hydraulic hand brake would be illegal because of the fact that there isn't an auxiliary braking system on the vehicle.

We'll keep this as a rally racer secret;)
 

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yeah works fine with drums or disc.

gotta check your circuits for dual diagonal and revise to front-rear and you gotta get the actuating pin position correct.

When its right, with almost no effort more than pulling the clutch on a motorcycle, you lock the wheels.
Hours of fun.

what class Fucus?














John Vanlandingham
 
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