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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
According to this months fastrack, the BoD was supposed to be presented a "package" that would in turn have clubrally "re-certified" on July 7th. Did this happen? Is anything holding it up?
JD Ackley
-from August's fastrack news, page f-200 article 1 of the prb minutes 6/18/03
 

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>No interest in club rally any longer?

I doubt that's the situation. It's just that nobody knows anything. Business as usual. (IMHO, it's a little too early to find anything out if the meeting was just Monday).
 

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RE: club rally

It seems to me that they are providing some information, but instead of praising the progress that the SCCA has made, we would rather chastise them for not making enough progress or a lack of speed. This is a daunting task, I think that the effort is being made, it is evident by the fact that they were able to put together some needed steps for STPR.
Are we only capable of "bitching" on this forum??
A link was posted regarding the possibility of the Club re-certification "http://www.specialstage.com/forum/cgi-bin/DCForumID2/1498.html" and all anyone wants to talk about is PDF??
What the hell is wrong with you people??
I am not saying all is fixed, but if we spent half the effort in looking at what they have accomplished that we put toward what the SCCA is doing wrong, we should see that the effort is being made...

I am disgusted with the whole damn thing!!

Steven Perret
Car# 226
Driftin4 Racing
[email protected]
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Steven wrote:

"Are we only capable of "bitching" on this forum??
A link was posted regarding the possibility of the Club re-certification "http://www.specialstage.com/forum/cgi-bin/DCForumID2/1498.html"; and all anyone wants to talk about is PDF??
What the hell is wrong with you people??
I am not saying all is fixed, but if we spent half the effort in looking at what they have accomplished that we put toward what the SCCA is doing wrong, we should see that the effort is being made...
I am disgusted with the whole damn thing!!

Steven Perret
Car# 226
Driftin4 Racing
[email protected]"

Before you jump on my case, I made no mention of any gripe I might have. Like most of the people on this board, I'm a club guy with alot of bucks tied up in the sport. I would like to schedule the rest of my rallying for the year, be it here at my home events or in Canada.

But as part of a not for profit CLUB I deserve information on descisions as they are made. 24 hours is more than enough time to post a synopsys of what went down at there little pow-wow.

I would love to do my home events, boycotting them only hurts the organizers that broke there backs to bring the rallies to fruition. Canada has some fine rallies and I am more than willing to travel if the SCCA can not get its act together in time.

And to answer your question Mr Perret,(RE:What the hell is wrong with you people??) I guess for me its a mixture of lost friends, strong passion for rally, and general uncertainy of what the secret car club of America is up to.
 

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JD

I did not intend to come off like I jumping on you about this, quite the opposite. You have shown interest in what you read in Fastrack, but not many people seem all that interested in talking about what it said.

If you check the forum for my other posts, you will see that I am right there with you!! My disgust lies in the fact that we all (Including myself!!) jumped on their knee jerk reaction, but when it seems like they are trying to do something we suddenly loose our ability to speak.

It seems that every one goes off on the SCCA lack of communication, but when they communicate, no one wants to talk about it. Look at all of the post's here about SCCA bulletins in relationship to this suspension, they all died quick with very little response. That is my point!!

I am a Club guy. I am not interested in being a Pro guy at the current cost.
I have invested way too much time and money in my program (just ask my wife). I decided to keep driving a $200 dollar car every day so I could invest a car payment into my rally program. This is how I justify the expense to myself.

I do not understand how they could do what they have done to Club Rally alone. However, they have worked to get Club going again and I commend them for that!!



Steven Perret
Car# 226
Driftin4 Racing
[email protected]
 

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>
>But as part of a not for profit CLUB I deserve information
>on descisions as they are made. 24 hours is more than
>enough time to post a synopsys of what went down at there
>little pow-wow.
>
So let's give them 24 hours. That probably won't be until about 6 hours from now. (Exact time as I type this is 5:12PM CDT) I suspect the call last night took a long time.
Richard Miller
 

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>I posted on the 8th, todays the 9th. The call went down on
>monday, the 7th.
From 7 to 9 PM on the 7th. Twenty four hourss from this would have been 9PM last night the 8th. The minutes should be posted soon although I do not remember the normal cycle.

The Board of Directors in general have day jobs so that they can afford the pleasure of our abuse. We do not pay them. This was a normal BoD meeting. Or send an e-mail directly to your BoD member. You do remember who you voted for? You did vote?

I talked to my representative on the board last night. The plan is coming along but not yet final. The reason is that there is not a pressing need to have the plan finalized at this time because the upcoming events in July and August have made other arrangements or are running in conjunction with Pro events. The Board is aware of the schedule and plans to have a ClubRally safety plan approved before it causes any more events to be postponed. The ProRally Board also have day jobs that need constant attention. Despite what you may have read here and elsewhere, Subaru and Mitsi do not pay their salaries.

Richard Miller
 

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RE: club rally

>I talked to my representative on the board last night. The
>plan is coming along but not yet final. The reason is that
>there is not a pressing need to have the plan finalized at
>this time because the upcoming events in July and August
>have made other arrangements or are running in conjunction
>with Pro events. The Board is aware of the schedule and
>plans to have a ClubRally safety plan approved before it
>causes any more events to be postponed. The ProRally Board
>also have day jobs that need constant attention. Despite
>what you may have read here and elsewhere, Subaru and Mitsi
>do not pay their salaries.<

Richard,

SCCA National is on PROBATION with ClubRally members and needed to close this issue promptly. Too bad it didn't. If your information is correct, the Board has made a very large error in judgement.

The Board COULD HAVE reinstated ClubRally contingent upon future approval of a New Safety Plan. As it is, there is still no scheduled ClubRally future; and ClubRally people no longer blindly trust the BOD and PRD to do the right thing.

Support for the Performance Rally Board (PRB) remains fairly strong. (Support would be much stronger if members were elected.) But, it is also known to be completely powerless.

Rich Smith

Vive le "Pro-le-Ralliat"
 

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RE: club rally

>
>The Board COULD HAVE reinstated ClubRally contingent upon
>future approval of a New Safety Plan. As it is, there is
>still no scheduled ClubRally future; and ClubRally people no
>longer blindly trust the BOD and PRD to do the right thing.
>
>Support for the Performance Rally Board (PRB) remains fairly
>strong. (Support would be much stronger if members were
>elected.) But, it is also known to be completely powerless.
>
>Rich Smith
>
>Vive le "Pro-le-Ralliat"
Snipped the first part of your message. The Board is not the one with final approval. It is the insurance underwriter. The Board is working along with the PRB to make sure the plan presented to the insurance company has all the T's crossed and the I's dotted.

As to the direct election of the PRB and for that matter the Competition Board and Solo Events Board, that would require a change in the by-laws of the SCCA. You can get started on doing this by reading the by-laws. Given the low number of people that vote in any election these days, if we, the rally community, wanted to affect the overall SCCA, we could if we all voted in a bloc.
Richard Miller
 

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RE: club rally

Given the low number of
>people that vote in any election these days, if we, the
>rally community, wanted to affect the overall SCCA, we could
>if we all voted in a bloc.
>Richard Miller

Richard is correct as usual...my research has shown that there are Areas where about the same number of people cast ballots for the winning director as there are rally licensees in the Area. Wouldn't take but a few of your road racing and SoloII friends to get you elected.

First, of course, we need a viable candidate who has the time and energy to dedicate to the job...and it's a three-year hitch. Any volunteers?

Bruce
 

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RE: club rally

The southwest division board position is up for election this year. Any volunteers from our region? There are 4 possible nominees at the moment although none have filed their paper work yet. All are race oriented. And yes, I possibly could win but I do not have the time to devote to the job and to continue to rally and to organize rallies. Plus the national politics of pro versus club would get to me. And by the way, this is pro racing versus club racing, not rally. Or did you not realize that we are not alone?
Richard
 

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RE: club rally

Richard,

As a matter of POLICY, the BOD could require that candidates for appointment to the Performance Rally Board (PRB) be elected by the licenced rally competitors. This would not require any ammendmnts to Bylaws. I think it would greatly enhance member support.


Bruce and Richard,

Voter apathy or cronyizm is no excuse to avoid Democracy. It is the best reason to have elections. Giving people an active voice that has effect tends to do away with cronyizm and apathy. Valid elections always enhance credibility and support.


Rich Smith

Vive le "Pro-le-Ralliat"
 

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RE: club rally

Alternate insurance is available.

To me, it seems a bit of a conflict of interest to have Pete Lyon as both a board member (advocating single source insurance coverage) and the provider of that same (again, single source - read no competitive bidding) insurance coverage.

I think that 'cronyism' is the right word in this scenario

Matt Manspeaker
Seattle, WA USA
89 323GTX - OPEN
97 Escort Cosworth - WIDE OPEN
 

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RE: club rally

>
>
>
>Richard,
>
>As a matter of POLICY, the BOD could require that candidates
>for appointment to the Performance Rally Board (PRB) be
>elected by the licenced rally competitors. This would not
>require any ammendmnts to Bylaws. I think it would greatly
>enhance member support.
Rich, here is the applicable section of the by-laws showing that the BoD appoints other boards.
Article VI
Section 3. Appointment of Committees. The Board of Directors shall appoint such other committees and boards as shall be necessary to regulate the competition activities of the Club and to advise and assist the Board of Directors concerning the affairs of the Club, and shall appoint the chairperson thereof.

And here is the section on amendments showing that this can not be changed as a matter of policy:
ARTICLE XI
Amendment
The Board of Directors, or three per cent or more of the Regular Members, of whom no more than one-third shall be from the same Area, may propose an amendment to the certificate of incorporation or bylaws by submitting such proposal in writing to the secretary. A proposal submitted by the Members shall be reviewed by a committee of five Regular Members, consisting of four Members appointed by the Board of Directors, two of whom are Members proposing the amendment, and a fifth Member appointed by these four Members, who shall act as a chairperson. The committee shall consider the propriety of the proposal, taking into account the intent of the Petitioners and the suitability of the inclusion of the proposal in primary instruments such as the certificate of incorporation and bylaws, and shall draft the proposed amendment into suitable language. Proposals of either origin shall be submitted to the vote of the Regular Member by mailing notice of the proposal and a form of ballot to all Regular Members. Each Regular Member shall be entitled to one vote on each proposal submitted to the membership. At least 30 days shall be allowed for voting. Ballots shall be mailed for counting to the firm of certified public accountants serving as the Club auditor, and shall not be available for inspection by any officer, Member, or employee. If at least two-thirds of the Regular Members voting are in favor of the amendment, it shall be adopted. The secretary shall cause the result of the balloting to be published for the information of the entire membership.


>
>Bruce and Richard,
>
>Voter apathy or cronyizm is no excuse to avoid Democracy. It
>is the best reason to have elections. Giving people an
>active voice that has effect tends to do away with cronyizm
>and apathy. Valid elections always enhance credibility and
>support.

So vote for your member of the BoD since that is all that is allowed under the present by-laws. Then get 3% of the membership to petition to change the by-laws. Easy to talk about. Now go do it! I will sign the petition.
Richard
PS: Needs to be real signatures in ink from valid paid up members.
>
>
>Rich Smith
>
>Vive le "Pro-le-Ralliat"
 

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RE: club rally

>Alternate insurance is available.
>
>To me, it seems a bit of a conflict of interest to have Pete
>Lyon as both a board member (advocating single source
>insurance coverage) and the provider of that same (again,
>single source - read no competitive bidding) insurance
>coverage.
>
>I think that 'cronyism' is the right word in this scenario
>
>Matt Manspeaker
>Seattle, WA USA
>89 323GTX - OPEN
>97 Escort Cosworth - WIDE OPEN
Matt,
If you feel this to be true, ask your member of the board. Remind them of the by-laws. Here it is, also from section VI,

Section 6. Conflict of Interest. No officer, Director or employee of the Club may participate in, or attempt to influence any decision by the Club affecting his or her own personal business interests, or otherwise use his or her official position for personal gain.

Richard
 
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