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Thread: FWD limited slip diff

  1. #11
    100 oversquare right bentmettle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KTurner View Post
    I'm interested in who has been successful driving on a clutch pack diff with one axle. I know mine is shimmed pretty hard and it goes nowhere if I pop an axle. Most of people that I have talked to have had similar experiences to mine.
    Shimming only gets you pre-load. If you don't have enough active friction surface, it still may not be enough torque to drive what's remaining of your drivetrain.

    I broke one at STPR and did about 10-15 miles + a transit. It had a tough time getting uphill but it did it.

    Another at RWV, couldn't get up a sharper uphill, but we managed a few stage miles and a long transit after getting yanked up the hill.

    Super special at Ojibwe, it was slipping more than I'd like, and we got far enough to change it out.

    The next time it popped, at SnoDrift, we had nothing, which was the cue to finally get in there and recheck preload.

    When it broke on Chad, it had been re-built so it should have been working mostly correct at that point.

    I like plate difffs. I hate VW axles.


    to the OP:

    What car are you asking about?

    It's a lot of resources to test multiple configurations. You almost have to borrow cars.


    Diffs are tunable. Asking how they affect cars is asking what shocks do to handling. If you want less aggressive lock, you can use different ramp angles, or tune the clutch pack to 80% or 60% lock, change preload, etc.

    If you have the choice to buy a reasonably priced clutch diff, and will be able to keep up with at least every 5 events or so, get it. A torque biasing diff is not going to work properly when both wheels are spinning in loose gravel or snow.

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  3. #12
    400 flat to crest
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    Some people have done 12-15,000 miles and had the breakaway torque within 5 ft/lbs of what they had set it at 4 years earlier. Set preload tight---non power steering car with fast ratio steering-----and it won't be slipping, and if it's not slipping the discs aren't wearing...

    As for action, if it is set tight--say around 100 ft/lbs breakaway torque---- then you wouldn't say "it engages suddenly", the clutchs are tight and it's sending power to both wheels all the time. It only slips of its a big difference in side to side rotation, like a 90* turn and then only for the few rotations during which the wheels are turned..
    It's "always on---unless one has a funny ramp angle and no preload (which were developed for tarmac cars, but you would say it's sudden or disconcerting, they can't have cars jerking around.

    With power steering even higher breakaway is the norm, over 150 ft/lbs to 175 ft/lbs.. That is tight. (hence WRC drivers whining so muh when they have PS problems, its a bitch to turn then..

    With equal length driveshfts as in the Soooper Bitchin cars in the 2 bottom piccies, its barely an issue on gravel..
    John Vanlandingham
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  4. #13
    400 flat to crest
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wedge View Post
    Has anyone compared different types/brands/models in how they perform and how they affect handling?
    Of course but best is simply multi-plate diff set with lots of preload for a gravel and snow car.
    1) Multi-plate
    2) "pumped up" viscous

    there is no 3
    John Vanlandingham
    Sleezattle, WA, USA
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    Telephone +1 206 431 9696
    Rememeber the time zone difference

    Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

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  6. #14
    It is Flat on the Floor!! Davenport576's Avatar
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    If you do not want to take the trans out for diff maintainence and are ok with keeping an eye on axles, I would go welded. I never could afford an LSD clutch or gear type. So I welded mine. I liked it and never got stuck in the woods because of cv/axle troubles. Did not use power steering either. I would suggest power steering for a smaller person though. I do sell the Kazz diff and would like to get one when the funds are available for my own car. But the welded is what my budget can swing.

    Let me know if I can help out!

    Doug Davenport
    www.davenportracingusa.com

  7. #15
    Uh Oh, UH OH, UHH OHHH!!! johnhuebbe's Avatar
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    Didn't rally hippy have a welded diff & kept breaking CVs in his VW Golf?
    Behold the POWER of cheese! www.huebberally.com
    Organizer: 100aw.org & perryville.100aw.org/ | Rally Cars: 1970 VW Beetle & 1991 Subaru Legacy

  8. #16
    into right 2 tightens
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    Lincoln Locker.

    Oskar the Citation is welded, I broke an axle and didn't know til i noticed it was a lot easier to turn in my parkinglot
    Tony
    KC0VSL
    Oskar-the Citation.

    "It ain't what a man Don't know that hurts Him, Near as much as what he Knows that just ain't so."
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  9. #17
    400 flat to crest
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    Be careful in the choice.
    Re Kaaz:
    Speak with Mr Turner above, or Alex Rademacher or or anybody about 6-8 month timeframe for ordinary service parts and near stonewalling about diff parts---shit happens, sometimes a bearing seat beats up and getting told "We can't supply one end of the housing-( something that might cost $85 for some brands), so buy a new diff..." for even very popular vehicles SHOULD give one pause about the bisiness.
    The hyer thin discs and plates--done in a effort to make LOTS or area is kinda nice idea, but in service the "ears' or "tabs" break off because the material is so thin...again something too common for the miles people average.. Fatter discs and plates wiould be an obvious solution..
    If they didn't want to sell the big pile of discs and plates all the time for big money, that is...
    John Vanlandingham
    Sleezattle, WA, USA
    www.rallyrace.net/jvab
    www.rallyanarchy.com

    Telephone +1 206 431 9696
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  10. #18
    100 oversquare right bentmettle's Avatar
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    The last major problem I had with the Gripper was the bellevilles that preload the plates broke.

    The discs in the unit were between .8mm and 1.2 in thickness typically, and had EDM cut splines. No issues with those wearing or breaking.

    If I bought one again, I'd get a set of discs and washers with the diff. When they need to be rebuilt, waiting for more parts is usually going to be super irritating.

  11. #19
    400 flat to crest
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    Quote Originally Posted by bentmettle View Post
    The last major problem I had with the Gripper was the bellevilles that preload the plates broke.

    The discs in the unit were between .8mm and 1.2 in thickness typically, and had EDM cut splines. No issues with those wearing or breaking.

    If I bought one again, I'd get a set of discs and washers with the diff. When they need to be rebuilt, waiting for more parts is usually going to be super irritating.
    If the parts must come from overseas, then that is smart thinking...

    Some are lucky that their diff uses plain old Dana 30 plates and discs...
    John Vanlandingham
    Sleezattle, WA, USA
    www.rallyrace.net/jvab
    www.rallyanarchy.com

    Telephone +1 206 431 9696
    Rememeber the time zone difference

    Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

  12. #20
    It is Flat on the Floor!! Davenport576's Avatar
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    You do need to drive a little different with a welded diff. No dumping the clutch at full lock! I never tried the high end or even brand new cvs. I used rebuilt axles due to budget. Two joints broken in 6 years and each time drove to service and changed it.

    Doug
    www.davenportracingusa.com

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