Scenario Planning - Page 2
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Thread: Scenario Planning

  1. #11
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    • What do you do if you realize you just pulled away from the finish time control and don't have your time card?
    >>> You may not reverse in a control (or anywhere on stage for that matter). Stop the car, and have the co-driver walk back to the stage finish control to retrieve your time card.

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  3. #12
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    • What do you do if you have already checked in, and are sitting in the time control, and realize you have a flat or some other mechanical problem?
    >>> Since it's a 10 minute penalty for servicing in a control zone, start the stage as normal, and pull off once you have passed the 100 yard board, signifying the end of the control zone past the stage start (if there is no finish control zone board, err on the side of caution, and go at least a couple hundred yards). Note: you may want to tell the stage start workers what you plan to do, so they can alert following competitors to be on the lookout. Pull off somewhere safe, change tire there. Continue. Of course, depending on the nature of the problem, it may be worth taking 10 minute time penalty, and any potential late start penalty, if you think the problem will take longer to solve than the amount of time you will be penalized.

    • Conversely, what do you do if you discover you have a flat or some other severe mechanical problem just before you entering a time control zone / checking in?
    >>> Since late check in penalties are usually only 10 secs per minute or 12 secs per minute (normally specified in the supp regs), it's probably worth fixing the flat first, and then checking in late, since you'd actually lose less time that way. Of course, if it's nothing severe, you can try and fix it on the next transit (once you are 100 yards past the finish time control zone, not the stage finish, you still have to clear the stage, and go to the FTC, get your time entered on your time card, and go 100 yards past the FTC). Note: if the start control zone is backed up, if you have already checked in with your time card, you are technically still in a time control zone, whether or not your car is physically inside the time control zone or not.

  4. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by JC Bourgeois View Post
    • What do you do when you notice when a timing error puts you behind another competitor in the dust vs being first on the road (this one actually happened to me)?
    Had that happen to me. I posted faster stage times then the car behind, but he got reseeded ahead of me.
    I did nothing about it
    due to an other competitor missing his arrival time the truck that got reseeded ahead of me got a huge dust window , (prescott, at night, worst dust i've ever seen)
    I got screwed by the reseed, with the truck ahead of me and having like a 6 minute window he was faster, i was driving very blind much of the stage.

    hind sight? i think having the navigator inquiry, or at least ask the guy doing the reseed is worth while.

    Though I'm not sure about fixing reseeds ?!?

    I've also had a timing error at Idaho, Navigator asked T&S to check the time cards, error was found easily . (something like giving me a 12:34 instead of a 10:34) mistake was also big enough that i pointed out the car behind me should have actually passed me on stage if my time was correct, but they didn't pass me.
    Welcome to Rally Addicts anonymous! Hi I'm Alex Rademacher, and i have a Rally problem..... 23 rallies and counting....

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  6. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by A1337STI View Post
    Had that happen to me. I posted faster stage times then the car behind, but he got reseeded ahead of me.
    I did nothing about it
    due to an other competitor missing his arrival time the truck that got reseeded ahead of me got a huge dust window , (prescott, at night, worst dust i've ever seen)
    I got screwed by the reseed, with the truck ahead of me and having like a 6 minute window he was faster, i was driving very blind much of the stage.

    hind sight? i think having the navigator inquiry, or at least ask the guy doing the reseed is worth while.

    Though I'm not sure about fixing reseeds ?!?

    I've also had a timing error at Idaho, Navigator asked T&S to check the time cards, error was found easily . (something like giving me a 12:34 instead of a 10:34) mistake was also big enough that i pointed out the car behind me should have actually passed me on stage if my time was correct, but they didn't pass me.
    When it happened to me the competitor in front of me didn't bring driving lights and I was chasing him down for the overall win. I caught him on stage and since it was the last stage of the rally and was dark, I was pushing to make sure I stayed ahead but ended up driving virtually blind through a number of corners (and series of corners) using the notes only as my guide. Scary stuff. Came close to having a major off a couple of times on that particular stage. In the future, I will demand a re-seed if I think there is a chance of catching the guy in front of me. However, in that event, we figured we wouldn't but really didn't factor in him not having driving lights.

    PS Audi - Great stuff! Keep it coming...
    Rally - Racing the way nature intended it.

  7. #15

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    Great thread
    As mentioned, some of these scenerios have only moments for you to react to them, and if you have not planned ahead of time it'll cause you a big problem if / when they happen to you. Experience is a great teacher, but listening to the experience of others is even better ( and cheaper) .

    It's been mentioned, but let me re-iterate. Know your car and where all the gear is stored, as well know where the fragile parts are - A left front flat on a Subie is, in my opinion, a STOP no matter how far ( unless you've added some protection - HINT, HINT- ) imagine how much time you will loose when the tire cuts the wiriing harness that's above that little plastic splash shield and you are looking at 50+ wires that need re-connecting - pretty much a for sure DNF / season done 'til you replace the harness. I've seen it take out a factory team.

    All cars have vulnerable places that it pays to keep in mind, especially after a small off when you are deciding if / what has to be done, to continue.

  8. #16

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    Just thought of a PS

    Extend the scenerio planning to your service crew. Make sure everyone knows where everything is and what HAS to be done at service - back to my comment about everycar having "weak " points I used to crew for a 323GTX Mazda and a mandetory part of every service was remove the wheels and dig out the gravel from the brakes - then figure out what else needs repair ( not much usually).

  9. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Audi UrQ View Post
    • What do you do if you realize you just pulled away from the finish time control and don't have your time card?
    >>> You may not reverse in a control (or anywhere on stage for that matter). Stop the car, and have the co-driver walk back to the stage finish control to retrieve your time card.
    Very, very good advice, in the RA rules, but NOT in the NASA rules. I grew up in the RA rules and about had a fit when one of the Irish backed up in my finish control to complain about something (We were right ). No rule in NASA RS.

    Don't do it, rule or not. It's dangerous. Workers are expecting one way traffic.
    Tony
    KC0VSL
    Oskar-the Citation.

    "It ain't what a man Don't know that hurts Him, Near as much as what he Knows that just ain't so."
    -Mark Twain

  10. #18
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    Is it a rule that you can't back up anywhere on the special stage? or just in Transits?

    like if you get stuck on a bank, and back up to get back on the road, Penalty ?

    if you back up to tow someone off a berm? penalty?

    Thinking back of Gorman when i wanted to try and give Welker a pull, but i would have had to 1) back up, 2) completely block the stage on a narrow narrow road. i was fwd and open diff at the time so there was a Great chance the car behind me would have came around the corner to see a car trying to be pulled off.

    Piers helped me make the safer decision to continue on. ( i did feel bad about it) but there was really a good chance i would be held up a minute or more. (last time i pulled someone off a berm it was about 45 seconds before i was moving on stage again, but that was on a wider road with 2 minute windows)

    maybe we had 2 minute windows ?? i don't recall .

    Anywho answers anyone? hehe
    Welcome to Rally Addicts anonymous! Hi I'm Alex Rademacher, and i have a Rally problem..... 23 rallies and counting....

  11. #19

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    Interesting question...
    For what it's worth up here in CARS land, the only mention of reversing is in a control zone, which is a 10 minute penalty. However there is a penalty for " balking " ( unreasonably delaying another competitor ) and I would think blocking the road to pull someone out would count, and that is up to the steward but could mean exclusion from the event.

    In all cases keep in mind SAFETY first, anyone you find in a ditch has been there at least 1 minute - so are effectively out of contention in the rally. My normal role is course closing and I really hate seeing anyone DNF an event, and will do my best to pull people out and keep them in it, but have had a few cases of breaking tow straps to make me think about safety first, if they are really in we have a big tow truck to pull them out after they DNF. The last strap that broke put a hole through my tailgate ( not a big deal - I work for a bodyshop - for now I'm leaving the hole as a reminder ) BUT I am happy it hit my truck rather than a spectator /crew member

  12. #20

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    If you have a radio in the car get the rally net frequencies and program them in before the event starts. And not just to listen to what's going on. Make sure you can transmit (offsets, tones, etc). At the scene of an incident is not the time to learn how to set up your radio. Rally nets do not want teams broadcasting on their frequencies but of course you can if it's a safety or emergency issue. For those who don't know, if there's an emergency, wait for the next break in net traffic and call "break! break!" and wait for acknowledgement. Your codriver should be in the habit of marking the notes whenever you stop or see a reportable issue so you know exactly where you are. It's not so helpful to report a position as "about half way in". :-)

    One more thing, most radios have a lock feature. Learn how to use it and makes sure it's locked when not in use. Especially in a rally car it's quite possible to switch frequencies or even key the mic accidentally. And if you use APRS (like us) switch it off before moving to a net control frequency. We're guilty of that - sorry guys - lesson learned.

    Simon
    Rallye Driver
    USUK Racing

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