Hydraulic Handbrake
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Thread: Hydraulic Handbrake

  1. #1

    Default Hydraulic Handbrake

    Is it common practice to run a hydro hand brake into the OEM system and use the OEM (or upgraded) rear calipers or to add a second set of calipers and run a stand alone system?

    Who makes the "go to" master?

    I can fab it up either way. Just wondering what par for the course is.

    Thanks
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  3. #2
    The Scorpion King John Sundelin's Avatar
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    The handbrake master usually gets plumbed in line with the rear calipers (so there's only one set). How it actually gets done can be a bit more complicated. If your master is plumbed in an X configuration, and you want to (or have to) keep it that way, AP Racing would like to collect an armful of your money for the CP6026. I think Brembo makes one also, but I can't find it offhand.

    The more conventional approach is to plumb the front and rear either separately or from different chambers on a dual master cylinder, then run the rear line to the handbrake, then back to the calipers. The Girling 3502 works well for this, as well as a Wilwood cylinder that looks identical.

    --
    John

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    50 caution yump phlat65's Avatar
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    I used the CNC staging brake in my car, it was pretty inexpensive, and works great. And yes, plumb it in line to the rear calipers, AFTER the proportion or limit valve.
    #141
    1986 Group5 Merkur XR4Ti
    Sean and Jenne Medcroft

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  6. #4
    100 K left 2 205's Avatar
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    Default CNC is the way to go....

    I have two cars both with a CNC unit .
    But the trick for the x pattern cars is to get the CNC unit that has two plungers (this is used for turning brakes for sand rails)and make two handels into one by welding/or bolting them together.
    After that it is just the time to rerun your brake lines down the trans tunnel.
    Todd

  7. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Sundelin View Post
    The handbrake master usually gets plumbed in line with the rear calipers (so there's only one set).
    Using one set of calipers seems a lot easier. Thanks for the heads up.

    Quote Originally Posted by John Sundelin View Post
    How it actually gets done can be a bit more complicated. If your master is plumbed in an X configuration, and you want to (or have to) keep it that way.

    The more conventional approach is to plumb the front and rear either separately or from different chambers on a dual master cylinder, then run the rear line to the handbrake, then back to the calipers. The Girling 3502 works well for this, as well as a Wilwood cylinder that looks identical.
    John
    Quote Originally Posted by phlat65 View Post
    And yes, plumb it in line to the rear calipers, AFTER the proportion or limit valve.
    I’m not exactly sure what you guys mean by X style but I can picture what I think it is. I just got under my “street” car (same chassis I am starting with for the Rally car) and the two rear brake lines run separately from each other all the way too the ABS module/distribution block which sits right behind the DS headlight (fantastic spot!). On the Rally car I will be ditching the ABS because it’s useless on everything but hot tarmac and it weighs a TON. So for the most part I will be running all new lines.

    Since I will be running all new lines I can do anything I want. I would rather stick with the OEM master for cost and simplicity reasons. The OEM master has two outlets. Am I correct in assuming that I would be splitting one off to run the front brakes? And splitting the other off, running it into a cabin mounted adjustable proportioning valve then to the rear brakes. And lastly “jumping” the handbrake master into the rear brake lines near the calipers?

    On a basic level would that be the plan?

    If running the lines to the handbrake and then to the calipers would I be going from the master to the proportioning valve, then too the handbrake where it would “T’” in, and then to the calipers? Is that right? I feel like I am missing something.

    Quote Originally Posted by phlat65 View Post
    I used the CNC staging brake in my car, it was pretty inexpensive, and works great.
    Quote Originally Posted by 205 View Post
    I have two cars both with a CNC unit .
    But the trick for the x pattern cars is to get the CNC unit that has two plungers (this is used for turning brakes for sand rails)and make two handels into one by welding/or bolting them together.
    After that it is just the time to rerun your brake lines down the trans tunnel.
    Todd
    Is this the CNC Staging Brake in question:
    http://www.cncbrakes.com/hsb.asp?grp...412&subseries=

    Is this the dual master setup you were referring too (that’s pretty cool!):
    CNC 452A Series Angled Dual Handle
    http://www.kartek.com/product/Brakes/TurningBrakes.html

    No issues pounding on them during corner entry or is it geared more toward staging and not real happy about being “abused”?

    I could start with a master and fab everything else up but buying a complete unit and not having to do any R&D would be fantastic. Looking for some guidance here.

    Thanks a lot guys!
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  8. #6
    The Scorpion King John Sundelin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoadRacer78 View Post
    ...Snip...

    Since I will be running all new lines I can do anything I want. I would rather stick with the OEM master for cost and simplicity reasons. The OEM master has two outlets. Am I correct in assuming that I would be splitting one off to run the front brakes? And splitting the other off, running it into a cabin mounted adjustable proportioning valve then to the rear brakes. And lastly “jumping” the handbrake master into the rear brake lines near the calipers?

    On a basic level would that be the plan?

    If running the lines to the handbrake and then to the calipers would I be going from the master to the proportioning valve, then too the handbrake where it would “T’” in, and then to the calipers? Is that right? I feel like I am missing something.
    That's may be exactly right. However, you might also want to put the proportioning valve in between the front calipers and the master cylinder. It all depends on the ratio of your front to rear brakes, especially if you are going to be upgrading calipers. The Tilton web site has instruction sheets on their proportioning valves that has lots of useful information.

    --
    John

  9. #7
    Opel is a 4-letter word... Ascona73's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoadRacer78 View Post
    I’m not exactly sure what you guys mean by X style but I can picture what I think it is.
    He means a split-diagonal master cylinder, which I think is pretty standard on all cars built in the past 20+ years.

  10. #8
    50 caution yump phlat65's Avatar
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    Here is mine, you can barely see the seven position lever style prop valve just on the other side of the hand brake. And yes, you can abuse it.



    Here is a better picture:
    #141
    1986 Group5 Merkur XR4Ti
    Sean and Jenne Medcroft

  11. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Sundelin View Post
    That's may be exactly right. However, you might also want to put the proportioning valve in between the front calipers and the master cylinder. It all depends on the ratio of your front to rear brakes, especially if you are going to be upgrading calipers. The Tilton web site has instruction sheets on their proportioning valves that has lots of useful information.

    --
    John
    Cool, thanks for the heads up. I will check their site out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ascona73 View Post
    He means a split-diagonal master cylinder, which I think is pretty standard on all cars built in the past 20+ years.
    Rojer that, over. Thanks

    Quote Originally Posted by phlat65 View Post
    Here is mine, you can barely see the seven position lever style prop valve just on the other side of the hand brake. And yes, you can abuse it.
    Very cool, thanks for the pics.

    Did you end up going with the vertical mount first or did you try it in a more conventional “handbrake” type position first. I have been E-brake sliding cars around since I was 12 with stock E-brakes (in the snow) so I am used to where they are located. Have you found that mounting how you did provides you with an advantage? I can see having the shifter, handbrake and steering wheel close together could be a plus. Just wondering what your take is on it.

    What are the lines running along the other lines running along the trans tunnel? Fire suppression?

    Thanks a lot!
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  12. #10
    L5 Lg > 4 into Broken
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoadRacer78 View Post
    I can see having the shifter, handbrake and steering wheel close together could be a plus.
    Bingo, less time off of the wheel, plus you can keep the stock "parking brake" and not have to rig up a latch for the hydro brake...or look for large rocks at the stage start to keep the car from rolling.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoadRacer78 View Post
    What are the lines running along the other lines running along the trans tunnel? Fire suppression?

    Thanks a lot!
    Probably fuel, which should definitely be re-run inside the cabin if they are external. Subarus for instance are already inside, but on the rocker panel, so moving them to the tunnel can make them more "safe" if you are in a big off. Although, the tunnel does get mighty hot, so watch for that.

    Jeremy

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