Tow/service vehicle recommendations

[sameer]

I'm in the market to get me a tow / service vehicle for my newly minted rally team, and I was curious what people were recommending? I really have no experience with buying trucks -- I was sort of thinking a crew cab long bed 4x4 truck would be good, but don't really know how much hauling power one would recommend, etc. Also, it seems like crew cabs might not be available with long beds? Is a short bed enough to carry spares, tires, tools, etc? The F-150 is apparently the most popular full-size in the country, but does it deserve to be?

thanks.

[matt b]

Vans are fairly popular. Having your gear inside something out of the elements, with a few doors to get at things from various places is pretty nice.

What kind of spares and tools do you anticipate taking along?

How many crew members do you think would need to be shuttled?

[Adrian Wintle]

>
>Vans are fairly popular. Having your gear inside something
>out of the elements, with a few doors to get at things from
>various places is pretty nice.
>
>What kind of spares and tools do you anticipate taking
>along?
>
>How many crew members do you think would need to be
>shuttled?

Vans also allow you to lock up your valuable spares...

Also, consider what sort of weather you may be servicing in...

If you had to deal with real winter (it looks like you don't), I'd suggest that the ability of the heater system would be a concern. The (rented) 17-foot cube we used at Quebec one year could keep the back of the box above freezing (with the back door open) when the outside temp was about 15F.

I've serviced out of the back of most things from a VW Golf GTi to a 17-foot cube van. I like vans for a small privateer team because you can actually (sort of) stand up in them when you are searching for something. The GTi, however, was the best-handling service vehicle I've ever driven (even with 7 tires, gas, tools, jack, and spares on board).

Adrian

[David J]

Depending on your budget, a used ambulance is ideal. They have decent room inside, plenty of lights, heavy duty drivetrain, and you can speed without fear of tickets. We used an ambulance for the past 4 or 5 events and are happy with it, but since selling our rally car, I am interested in selling the ambulance. (just kidding about the tickets)
David J

[Sixonine]

My experience includes crewcabs, suburbans, vans, ex-ambulances, and cube trucks.

I would consider whether the vehicle will double as a daily driver. If it is separate and you have the funds, nothing beats a cube truck. It can separate you from the stuff and it provides room for everything.

Crewcabs (and Pickups). Separates stuff from occupants. Can sleep in back seat of crewcab. Inconvenient to reach items in back of bed. Most people buy a bed "camper" top. One crewcab had a truck body with all the boxes. It was useful. It was also heavy.

Suburbans and vans. Must carry items in vehicle. Should consider restraining mesh panel. We use a hitch carrier to store the gasoline on outside of the vehicle. Safer and no fumes. Room to sleep people on long tows.

Ex-ambulance was geared too low for highway use. RPMs were high and gas mileage was low. Does hold a lot of stuff conveniently and will sleep people.

If given the choice I would get a diesel. Good gas mileage with nice torque.

[sameer]

Thanks for the input, this is all really helpful. So 4wd isn't really necessary, then?

[Sixonine]

In my experience, 4WD is no more necessary for a service vehicle than for a street vehicle. 4WD is appreciated when the roads are covered with ice or snow, but generally not necessary. I can see that it could be useful in extracting an offed rally car. Most events have either a capable sweep team or people willing to help with the extraction though. 4WD is not required for general servicing at any events that I have attended.

[car302]

Sameer,

I went through the same thought process not too long ago. Some of the options I thought of:
[li]4x4 CrewCab longbed pickup (yes, they all come in longbed). To haul spares and such, I would personally go for 3/4 ton or larger. In 2002, we serviced out of a '69 Chevy C10 (1/2 ton w/ 3-on-the-tree!) with a topper. It was adequate, but we loaded it to the max all the time. CC would be nice for extra room for the crew, sleeping, whatever. But, with an 8' foot bed, it's a very long truck. Trucks are expensive, too.
[li] TurboDiesel pickup. You can't beat Diesel for torque and towing capacity, but they're way expensive (especially new ones). I'm an engineer that works on advanced TD powertrains, and they kick major a$$, but a new truck is mighty pricey ($35-$45k) for the full CC LB package. Can't beat the fuel mileage, either - 18 to 20 mpg in many 2WD pickups. Even used high mileage Diesel trucks command high prices (expensive).
[li]Box truck would be nice (gas is good, Diesel would be better), but the vehicle is pretty large. Requires a dedicated space to store it if you don't use it as a daily driver - hard to come by in Berkeley. But, if you have a place to store it, you could outfit the back in any way you like.
[li]15 passenger van or panel van. These have a good amount of space, things are easy to get at, and your gear is (generally) safer than in the back of a pickup with a topper. A van with a V8 is likely adequate for all towing (small or big block), and Diesel vans are a little more sporadic (you can find them if you look hard). Possibly the best thing about the van is that it can double as a daily driver, and it's way cheaper to buy and insure than a truck.


The route I chose was a 1993 Ford Econoline (van) 1 ton Clubwagon with a 351 V8. It's probably not the most powerful vehicle, nor is it the biggest, but for a club guy like me, it'll be big enough for what I need. And, as a financally limited racer (I assume you're somewhat in the same boat), the van represents the best compromise in terms of storage space, cost to buy (only $5k w/ 80k miles!), and daily driver capability. Sure, I don't pick up many chicks cruisin' in my big ol' van, but with a CRS sticker on the back, it ups the coolness factor a bit! :7

Good Luck.

[Lurch]

Shameless plug alert!

http://www.specialstage.com/forum/cgi-bin/DCForumID14/1247.html

This van has a sturdy parts organizer that won't let things go flying in an accident.

[indyalfa]

How about this one.

A formula car team I worked for solved their tow vehicle issue by using rental cube vans. We made storage inserts that we hooked to the wall of the box truck and rolled into our shop between events. It worked out really well. Even better if you can convince the rental company to sponsor your efforts. One caveat, these are not luxury vehicles.

Rich

[John Sundelin]

One thing to keep in mind on a diesel is that the cost of the engine can be made up in surprisingly quickly in fuel savings. That is assuming you have a gas motor of equivalent torque (i.e. big block Ford/Chevy). Diesel maintenance costs are a bit higher (15 qts of oil every change, more air filters, fuel filters, etc), but when you combine the fuel economy and the durability, if you have the cash on hand they can't be beat. Besides the occasional scent of unburned diesel, the only difficulty can sometimes be finding fuel.

One vehicle that I spent a lot of time looking at, but decided not to buy because I wasn't comfortable in the front seat is a Ford E Series "Crew Van". This is a relatively rare option, but if you get it with the extended van, you can carry five people in reasonable comfort along with a whole lot of stuff. It is roughly the same capacity as a long bed crew cab pickup in a slightly more driveable package.

Another idea is a Morgan Truck Body Husky Utility Body. Its basically a combination between a conventional utility bed and a box truck. My HOA at my previous residence would have frowned on it though.

I ended up getting a Ford F-250 crew cab with short bed and a cap. When loading it for a rally, I always want a longer bed. When driving it around an unfamiliar town once I get there, I always want a shorter bed, so I figure that it is a good compromise.

For fuel economy reference, I get about 14.5 mpg towing a 5500lb trailer with about 800-1000 lb of tools and spares in the back of the truck.


--
John

[sameer]

Hi, thanks all for the feedback, it's been really helpful. I ended up buying Andy Brown's E-350. Very similar to your van there lurch.

[joeg]

Too bad. You never considered a good used Hearse. Now that would certainly be the talk of the service areas!

Team Macarbe!

[lastcall]

As I was reading the rest of the posts I was thinking the same thing.

Our team uses my F150 Super Crew. It has a solid lockable cover on the bed. You have to pack carefully, it is okay, but it would be nice to have more room. We do not have a canopy and alot of the other things that a lot of you pack. We are new to rally, so we are still learning what we need to pack.

We have not had any trouble with towing a heavy trailer and rally car with the F150.

lastcall

[spacemonkey]

I too am looking for a low cost service/ tow vehicle. I was wondering what on average the needed towing capacity was (car plus trailer). I'm not having any luck looking up towing capacities to start my search w/. any help would be greatly appreciated.
chris-